It's almost as if the army is about killing people

[regexcellent]

So, I've observed some stuff in Army ROTC before, but not actually participated, and today was the first PT (physical training) session.

Anyone who has watched Full Metal Jacket knows that in the military PT runs are done to a cadence, consisting of lines which are shouted or sung by a leader, which everyone else repeats or responds to as a group. I hadn't really heard any cadences before today, and was mildly surprised by how unabashedly psychotic they can be.

For instance,

When I say one, you say two!
When I say fighting, you say for you!
When I say three, you say four!
When I say violence, you say some more!
When I say five, you say six!
When I say killing, you say for kicks!
When I say seven, you say eight!
When I say the army, you say is great!
When I say nine, you say ten!
When I say sing, you say it again!

One! Two! Fighting for you!
Three! Four! Violence...some more!
Five! Six! Killing for kicks!
Seven! Eight! The army is great!
Nine! Ten! Sing it again!

Then it just starts over.

There were others about running people over in tanks, killing terrorists in caves, invading Iran, and so on.

At first this struck me as kinda nuts, but then, as the title states, it's almost as if the army is principally concerned with killing people.

Meh.

[Hauldren Collider]

This is my rifle, this is my gun, this is for fighting, this is for fun!

[Bugs ****ing Bunny]

It's that age-old quandary. Are soldiers heroic defenders of our best virtues, or basically just hired thugs?

[regexcellent]

Why not both?

[Bugs ****ing Bunny]

It's one of those combinations that are tricky to combine. Like quadriplegic trapeze artists, for example.

No disrespect to any quadriplegic trapeze artists, by the way. God speed, you magnificent bastards.

[Al B. Sure!]

This stuff changes. I witnessed the changes first hand between as short as 2 years in two different OCS classes.

Under Colonel Mancini in 2008, there were no such references to violence in OCS. The instructors would even say how the 'mothers of America' didn't want their babies screaming kill! all the time. Where once candidates shouted kill!, they switched to drill! Violent references in cadences were forbidden.

In 2010, however, under Colonel Jackson, kill! returned in full force, as did all the other violent references.

This tells me that what is experienced in entry level training is largely staff dependent.

Never once did I hear anything about killing terrorists or Iran, though.


The Marine Corps is moving away from long platoon runs, anyway, though. We only ran so many platoon runs. More and more runs were sprints, suicides, or individual efforts. The focus in fitness was also more on functional fitness at exercise stations, with not so much running in general. As a result, I only heard a handful of cadences and there wasn't much violence in their content.

[Hauldren Collider]

Who the hell are Colonel Mancini and Colonel Jackson?

[Al B. Sure!]

Who the hell are Colonel Mancini and Colonel Jackson?

Two former CO's of OCS. I don't see how that wasn't obvious. They would dictate what happens at OCS.

[Hauldren Collider]

All of OCS or just your particular battalion?

[Al B. Sure!]

All of OCS or just your particular battalion?

OCS has only one battalion. They were battalion commanders. So all of OCS.

[Jon Miller]

It's that age-old quandary. Are soldiers heroic defenders of our best virtues, or basically just hired thugs?

Is becoming a soldier the process of changing a heroic human being into a thug...

JM

[regexcellent]

This tells me that what is experienced in entry level training is largely staff dependent.

Our cadences today were selected by whichever MS3 cadet happened to be calling at that time, and from what I could tell, were primarily based on what that particular cadet could remember. So they varied a lot. The cadre officers and NCOs were not involved in selecting the cadences for the most part, although the Master Sergeant did do the cadence about Iran.

[Aeson]

In my experience observing heroic tales ... yelling "death" (or otherwise pontificating about your impeding demise) is heroic while yelling "kill" means you're the bad guy.

[regexcellent]

Well we had a cadence about how an "airborne ranger lives a life of death and danger" as opposed to a more realistic notion where the airborne ranger sits around on a FOB for hours drawing dicks on the wall of a port-a-****ter waiting to go on a road patrol that ultimately gets canceled.

I mean I'm totally down for like, rangers running around suburban Virginia fighting commies or whatever like in Modern Warfare 2 but let's face it, it ain't gonna happen.

[Aeson]

... and yelling "drill" either means you're at a Republican rally or in some really raunchy porno.