House of Lords reform dropped

[Bugs ****ing Bunny]

If you're going to start spouting "steal" in a thread about taxation I'm going to start referring to you as tandee_taylor.

[kentonio]

Good! People shouldn't get to steal money just because they already spent all of theirs on something nice.

Steal money? You Americans are so quaint.

[Kuciwalker]

If you're going to start spouting "steal" in a thread about taxation I'm going to start referring to you as tandee_taylor.

The ones being stolen from are the poor, who could otherwise be given a more generous welfare state.

[Bugs ****ing Bunny]

You seem to be under the impression that we can't do both.

[Hauldren Collider]

You seem to be under the impression that we can't do both.

I don't know if across the pond you have infinite resources, but over here we have a notion of the fact that if you spend money on one thing, that's less that you can spend on another.

Well, everyone except congress has that notion, anyway.

[Bugs ****ing Bunny]

I don't know if over your side of the pond you have corporate activity and people who aren't poor, but over here we do, which presents an alternative option to assuming that only poor people can pay taxes.

[Kuciwalker]

You seem to be under the impression that we can't do both.

Resources are scarce. The ability to confiscate resources from some people to give them to others is even scarcer. It shouldn't be wasted on feel-good giveaways to the rich.

[Bugs ****ing Bunny]

If 50% of the population get a university education, how realistic is it to assume they'll all be rich?

[Fake Boris]

this is simply not true. the majority of students are middle class. students from poor families in the UK don't have to pay tuition fees, not that you'll hear about that from the, predictably middle class, commentators, complaining about how their little darlings oliver and emily have to pay towards the cost of their education.

Middle class people are not all that rich.

Especially not their kids.

[Fake Boris]

Graduates, however, are rich. Unless they study useless crap like Philosophy.

The rate of return on a philosophy degree is still 6.9% over a lifetime (in Canada).

[Fake Boris]

BTW, if you use the term "human capital" in a discussion about education, you're a freaking buffoon.

[Aeson]

Resources are scarce. The ability to confiscate resources from some people to give them to others is even scarcer. It shouldn't be wasted on feel-good giveaways to the rich.

You are ignoring that the ability to confiscate resources from some people to give them to others scales in regards to the groups involved. Money that was "saved" from the middle class would go to the rich (or stay with them). The poor exist because they don't have the ability to claim the wealth on their own (through the free market, politics, or otherwise), and we as a nation don't care enough to do it for them ... and that wouldn't change simply by giving the middle class less.

We already could eliminate poverty in the US (as in, under the poverty level) very easily if we wanted. We probably could do so for the entire world with a bit of dedication. We just don't care enough to do it. But we do care enough to help some kids go to school. Caring less isn't the answer here...

[OneFootInTheGrave]

Instead, the Scots get it all free, it being stolen from the English.

Scotland

[OneFootInTheGrave]

1)

2) Your observation ("it's easier for the rich to afford stuff") is true of every single sphere of life. That's the entire point of being rich. If being rich didn't mean that you got more/better stuff then who would bother? Taken to its final conclusion your position is literally socialism.

Yes, rich are not satisfied with huge houses, servants, yachts, airplanes and Bentleys, they would not bother getting rich if getting education was not easier for them than for the poor. Socialist scum, they want everybody to be the same.

[C0ckney]

Middle class people are not all that rich.

Especially not their kids.

you claimed they are poor. i just pointed out that they are not.

(and i'm using the english definition of middle class here).