A Game of Thrones - TV Show Discussion Thread

[Imran Siddiqui]

I will contend as well, that the last 300 pages of A Dance with Dragons is fantastic stuff. As good as the first three books. Which seems to back that the slog of Book 4 and early-mid Book 5 was because he couldn't figure out how to get through the "5 Years Later" stuff (he originally wanted it as flashbacks, but then realized it was much too much).

[Cort Haus]

Oh, and actually, Game of Thrones, Clash of Kings, and Storm of Swords makes a fantastic trilogy all by itself.

It would, if he'd managed to end it with Swarm of Words.

[Cort Haus]

So he needs an editor just as badly as Tolkien did?

Was LORT edited by a third party? I wasn't aware that it was, but I suspect that the new Firstname RR Lastname needs one far more badly.

There's fun to be had comparing the two. While I was reading Ice 'n Fire I was thinking that this was proper grown-up, morally ambiguous epic fantasy compared to the narrow, Christian simplistic dualities of Middle Earth. Now I have more respect for the reactionary, backward, anti-industrial old fascist for actually finishing his one.

[Imran Siddiqui]

I think GRRM knows where the plot is going (and he knows the ending). However, he has himself admitted that Books 4 and 5 were a slog because he was trying to fill in background for the final phase - ie, the 5 years between the War of the Five Kings and the Final Confrontation was difficult for him to bridge.

Oh, and actually, Game of Thrones, Clash of Kings, and Storm of Swords makes a fantastic trilogy all by itself.

[Dinner]

Yeah. If ever an author has literally lost the plot, it's this one.

It's more of that the series isn't just a plot of one group of people so much as a multigenerational epic tale of the struggle for power all set in a wonderfully intricate world which has a massive amount of things going on in the background. That does help make the world and the characters more real or believable (minus the liberal dash of magical stuff, of course).

[Dinner]

So he needs an editor just as badly as Tolkien did?

They don't call him "the American Tolkien" for nothing.

[Cort Haus]

This is what I was afraid of when I saw it had been originally planned as a trilogy.

Yeah. If ever an author has literally lost the plot, it's this one.

[Dinner]

And the world George R.R. Martin creates is ridiculously intricate. I mean I spend part of this afternoon reading about the Blackfyre Rebellion (well, it started as an attempt to satiate curiosity of whether Blackfyre is in fact Lightbringer). And that stuff happened 100 years before the first book began and tangentially relates to the plot...

Spoiler:

The Golden Company, now in the employ of Aegon Targaryen and Jon Connington, was formed by Bittersteel, a half brother of Daemon Blackfyre, and is determined to put a Blackfyre on the throne, but the male line of the Blackfyres was extinguished in the War of the Ninepenny Kings, so perhaps merely a Targaryen will do

The guy has been writing the series since 1990 and has only published six books during that entire time (at least for this series). He has had decades to come up with background material, refine it, and incorporate it in subtle ways into the main story line. He's done a hell of a job doing it too. I could see this series having the lasting power of Tolkien's work where people are still doing stuff with it 50 years from now just like people have been running with Tolkien's stuff decades after the man's death.

[Cort Haus]

[DinoDoc]

Although I was utterly engrossed and transfixed by the books (which might never be finished) at the time, after I finished them as far as they go I felt a bit frustrated by his meandering lack of focus. I should take this to the book thread really, and will (it's actually why I came back to this forum) but I honestly think he has over-indulged himself. I know some will strongly disagree, but it is fair to say that there has been some widespread disappointment at the endless procrastination of some story threads, and the introduction of new ones which some of us found tiresome.

Not a spoiler, just an honest personal answer to DD which differs from the opinions expressed so far.

This is what I was afraid of when I saw it had been originally planned as a trilogy.

[Bugs ****ing Bunny]

So he needs an editor just as badly as Tolkien did?

[Cort Haus]

Back to my question, would the 1st 2 seasons blu rays largely catch me up with yall? They way you people have been talking about it makes me interested.

I'd say get the discs, yes. Read the books too, if you don't mind being dicked about a bit by an author who can't finish what he started. (Puts on flame-retardent suit).

They're both good. Although I was utterly engrossed and transfixed by the books (which might never be finished) at the time, after I finished them as far as they go I felt a bit frustrated by his meandering lack of focus. I should take this to the book thread really, and will (it's actually why I came back to this forum) but I honestly think he has over-indulged himself. I know some will strongly disagree, but it is fair to say that there has been some widespread disappointment at the endless procrastination of some story threads, and the introduction of new ones which some of us found tiresome.

Not a spoiler, just an honest personal answer to DD which differs from the opinions expressed so far.

[Imran Siddiqui]

I haven't read that book series, but I can't think of a single fantasy or SF book series that is better than ASOIAF. I literally cannot think of anything else I'd rather read (and re-read) than this series.

And the world George R.R. Martin creates is ridiculously intricate. I mean I spend part of this afternoon reading about the Blackfyre Rebellion (well, it started as an attempt to satiate curiosity of whether Blackfyre is in fact Lightbringer). And that stuff happened 100 years before the first book began and tangentially relates to the plot...

Spoiler:

The Golden Company, now in the employ of Aegon Targaryen and Jon Connington, was formed by Bittersteel, a half brother of Daemon Blackfyre, and is determined to put a Blackfyre on the throne, but the male line of the Blackfyres was extinguished in the War of the Ninepenny Kings, so perhaps merely a Targaryen will do

[Dinner]

Re book vs TV series, I reserve judgement, but would say the books are better. If the TV series can make the following spoiler funnier than when I read it in the book, the TV series may win on that one count.

Spoiler:

Tywin's death

Spoiler:

Yeah, the whole Tywin Lanister ****s gold thing along with Tyrian confirming that Tywin Lanister did not in fact **** gold after he killed his own father.

[DinoDoc]

I haven't read that book series, but I can't think of a single fantasy or SF book series that is better than ASOIAF. I literally cannot think of anything else I'd rather read (and re-read) than this series.

This makes me feel better about searching for the books. After reading on wiki that it had originally planned as a trilogy that later got expanded, I was afraid it would be a little unfocused and that I'd loose interest because of that.