A Game of Thrones - TV Show Discussion Thread

[VetLegion]

Also Martin finished writing the fifth book a few hours ago, it'll be printed soon: http://grrm.livejournal.com/212603.html

Great!

[-Jrabbit]

I'm with you, Guynemer.

[Kuciwalker]

You agree that piracy and shoplifting are indistinguishable?

[DirtyMartini]

"Beep boop. In making your point your point that both involve taking something that does not belong to you without proper compensation you have made a semantic error that I will dwell on. Error. ErrOr. ERROR. Does not compute. Beep boop."

[Kuciwalker]

You don't think that's central to the issue?

"Intellectual property" conflates two entirely distinct market failures.

[Docfeelgood]

I just watch it, not download it.

[Guynemer]

You don't think that's central to the issue?

"Intellectual property" conflates two entirely distinct market failures.

So it would be okay to walk into a restaurant, order some food, eat it, and leave, because you were just trying it to see if it was worthwhile, or because you would eat it for free but wouldn't pay for it? I'm really not seeing any ethical distinction at all.

[Kuciwalker]

You mean, apart from the fact that the restaurant expended scarce resources (food and labor) on your behalf?

[Kuciwalker]

Property solves the tragedy of the commons. Intellectual "property" solves the free rider problem.

[Guynemer]

You are taking something that does not belong to you, and you are not paying for it. You can dress it up in all the fancy economic verbiage you'd like, but you haven't an ethical leg to stand on. Piracy is theft. When someone downloads a pirated copy of Galnemer's novel, they are stealing it. There is a perpetrator, there is a victim.

[Kuciwalker]

You are taking something that does not belong to you, and you are not paying for it. You can dress it up in all the fancy economic verbiage you'd like, but you haven't an ethical leg to stand on. Piracy is theft. When someone downloads a pirated copy of Galnemer's novel, they are stealing it. There is a perpetrator, there is a victim.

1) A day after the copyright expires, is it theft if I "take" a copy without paying for it?

2) If I have no money, and so could not pay her, is it theft if I "take" a copy without paying for it?

3) If I borrow a copy of the book from the library, is it theft?

4) If my friend gives me his physical copy of the book after reading it, is it theft?

5) If my friend gives me his digital copy of the book (deleting the copy on his hard drive) after reading it, is it theft?

6) If my friend gives me his digital copy of the book after reading it, doesn't delete the copy on his hard drive, but also never reads it again, is it theft?

[Kuciwalker]

Your entire notion of "belonging" here is just a scheme to produce benefits for consumers, not to recognize supposed inherent moral rights of authors.

[Guynemer]

1) A day after the copyright expires, is it theft if I "take" a copy without paying for it?

2) If I have no money, and so could not pay her, is it theft if I "take" a copy without paying for it?

3) If I borrow a copy of the book from the library, is it theft?

4) If my friend gives me his physical copy of the book after reading it, is it theft?

5) If my friend gives me his digital copy of the book (deleting the copy on his hard drive) after reading it, is it theft?

6) If my friend gives me his digital copy of the book after reading it, doesn't delete the copy on his hard drive, but also never reads it again, is it theft?

No yes no no no yes


Same would apply to music, games, etc.

[Kuciwalker]

Care to explain your answers? The fact that you gave different answers to 5 and 6 doesn't give you pause? What if I let you know that copyright law prohibits both 5 and 6? Would that change your answer to any of the questions?

[Aeson]

Technically it is theft in those jurisdictions which define it as such.