Was Hitler Austrian or German?

[Kitschum]

Oh, and of course, the "first victim" idea was helped by the fact that the Austrian state WAS the first victim.

After the German state of course. I mean the Reichstag coup and the Gleichschaltung were legally questionable I believe.

[JEELEN]

Quite so.

Austria is certainly Germanic, just as Ireland and Wales are Celtic. Austria just isn't a part of the modern German state. I don't see how that can be very complicated

I don't think anyone is argueing that.

This became the official name only in late medieval times IIRC. But there is certainly a lot of continuity from the early empire to the late HRE. ... Yes, but what does this mean for the HRE being a distinctive political unit? I am not sure what you mean by "its political clout soon dissolved".

The "real authority" of rulers was quite different at different times. In medieval times it was like in most other euro kingdoms - some rulers were "stronger" than others due to various reasons, and they usually traveled around and had to fight to reinforce their rule again and again.

We hardly would say England or Denmark have no political history/importance in say 10th, 11th or 12th century because of (sometimes) unstable/unsteady rule.

Later the German territorial rulers became more important indeed, but the emperor was still an important player, for example during the 30 years war. And there existed specific institutions, courts, and taxes with impact for the "Reich" or the emperor as such.

Medieval history is complex indeed, but the HRE hardly compares to the making of England, France or Denmark - simply because they are examples of growing national unity into a political entity. As you mention yourself, the Holy Roman emperor never rose above being a major player in his empire - if he was a strong ruler, that is. It's one of the major frustrations of 19th century (and later) German nationalists. And ofcourse I did not argue that the HRE had no political history or importance - but it was more similar to the Polish elective monarchy than the general trend in Western European monarchies towards centralization.

[SlowwHand]

Scotland, also Celtic.

[Wernazuma III]

A comparison between Poland and Hungary is outrageous. Poland was under brutal nazi occupation, milions of Poles were killed, resettled, sent to slave labour etc. Hungary was a nazi proxy.

I was referring to getting rid of the j00s.
About the Nazi machinery, I mentioned only the Hungarians; other filthy easteners in the text include mainly Croats and pro-German Ukrainians. I should have separated the two issues better.

[Wernazuma III]

After the German state of course. I mean the Reichstag coup and the Gleichschaltung were legally questionable I believe.

Well, maybe legally doubtful, but yet an inner problem. It's a completely different thing to invade a country that didn't invite you. Austria was invaded, though hailed and helped by many Austrians, before they could hold a referendum on the issue, then the government and political elite was deposed and imprisoned, except for the Nazi government members who had been installed a bit earlier, after German threats to invade in case that the government would not accept the demand...

Had the Austrians held the referendum, instead of the fake referendum after the Anschluss, maybe the state would have delivered itself, but as it was, it didn't. At least, Hitler must have feared a "close or negative result, which is why he invaded.

[Blaupanzer]

The official name of the HRE was "Holy Roman empire of the German nation"; it derived from the reign of Louis the German, one of three parts (the others being the medieval kingdoms of Lorraine and France - Franks, properly speaking) of the inheritance of Charlemagne's empire. while this may be seen as the first "German" empire, its political clout soon dissolved. The HRE was an elective monarchy, where the emperor was chosen by the princes elect and could claim no real authority throughout the Empire.

BUZZ!!! Where did you get this? The Treaty of Verdun in 843 divided the remaining Carolingian empire among Charlemagne's (Karl der Grosse's) three grandsons into East Francia, West Francia, and Middle Francia. East rapidly becomes distiguished as the Teutonic portion and soon adds "Italy," essentially the Lombards. At that time, the Pope begins to Crown the Emporers of the HRE as Emporer of Rome, just as a predecessor had crowned Charlemagne. (No Lorraine, no concession that Franks were only the western part, no tacit acknowledgement of germanicness. The label of the time for "German" areas is still Teutonic.)

[Felch]

Scotland, also Celtic.

Well yeah. I was giving examples, not an exhaustive list.

[JEELEN]

BUZZ!!! Where did you get this? The Treaty of Verdun in 843 divided the remaining Carolingian empire among Charlemagne's (Karl der Grosse's) three grandsons into East Francia, West Francia, and Middle Francia. East rapidly becomes distiguished as the Teutonic portion and soon adds "Italy," essentially the Lombards. At that time, the Pope begins to Crown the Emporers of the HRE as Emporer of Rome, just as a predecessor had crowned Charlemagne. (No Lorraine, no concession that Franks were only the western part, no tacit acknowledgement of germanicness. The label of the time for "German" areas is still Teutonic.)

That doesn't preclude what I stated; it's only a later development (where I forewent the original division after Charlemagne's death). Lorraine - or Lotharegnum - developed out of the reign of Lotharius, whereas the HRE and later kingdom of France developed out of the remains of respectively the West and East Frankian reigns. To be true, it might have gone otherwise, in which case there might not have been a France or HRE, but a strong Lorraine empire instead. As it was, this was not to be. (Although, ofcourse, the HRE never really was a strong empire - which was my point here.)