Case study in Republican insanity: California to go belly-up?

[Dinner]

education. That's what my state is cutting.

That is illegal to cut in California because of a proposition. It not only gets a set payment per year but the payment goes up each year with inflation because that is what the voters wanted. Literally they decided politicians couldn't be trusted and using a proposition took this funding decision out of the hands of the politicians. Legally the legislature couldn't cut it if they wanted to. They are legally required to fund that program (education) to a set amount. That's a large part of why Republicans are refusing to pass ANY budget not just the agreed upon compromise budget. The legislature simply does not have the legal power under the state constitution to cut any voter approved spending measure and simply must find some way to fund them.

[Dinner]

The Repugs just double downed. The Senate Minority Leader had compromised by agreeing to about $10 billion in tax increases, with the rest of the $40+ billion deficit coming from draconian cuts.

So the Republican caucus just fired him and is replacing him with a Repub says no tax increases at all.

You are right the extremists, and both parties in California are dominated by extremists because the gerrymandered district (by BOTH parties) tend to let extremists win primaries while the Nov elections are meaningless, and the extremists mounted a coupe against the state Republican leadership for daring to work towards a compromise solution. Make no mistakes the extremists absolutely control the state Republican party in this state and they'll attack people on their own side who don't tow the party line. The former (as of yesterday) state Republican leader's only fault was agreeing that it is mathematically impossible to end the deficit with just budget cuts (there is more deficit spending by the state as a percentage of the budget then there is decressionary spending to cut) and so some modest tax increases would be needed. For admitting that basic fact in public the right wing extremists had him removed as leader of the state Republican Party. That basically tells you all you need to know about who is responsible for shutting down the state government.

It's like 1998 all over again when the Republicans refused to pass a budget and shut down the federal government and just like 1998 this will blow up in their faces. When sick and dying people can no longer get health care because MediCAL isn't paying any bills, and when unemployed people stop getting their unemployment insurance checks, and when people can't go to the DMV, when the highway patrol/state troopers stop working because they're not being paid, and when when prisons are shut down because there is no money to buy inmates food, and when courts shut down because no one is getting paid, and a million other things then citizens will look around for someone to blame. The blame will almost certainly fall on the extremists who refused to make ANY compromise in order to get a state budget passed. Mark my words this will blow up in the faces of the state Republican Party.

[Imran Siddiqui]

The Republicans shut down the federal government in 1998?

[Dinner]

He himself included ?

Naturally he exempts himself from his hate.

[DinoDoc]

then citizens will look around for someone to blame.

They should look in the mirror is they want someone to blame.

[Agathon]

Does anyone else find it funny that one of the world's largest economies (California is the eighth largest I think) has managed to turn itself into an ungovernable swill?

[Dinner]

Actually, I wonder if you could have a referendum to allow simple majorities in the assembly to pass tax increases.

That would be very hard. Revising part of the state constitution has to be passed by proposition and then a 2/3rds vote in both houses of the state legislature if someone wants to simply add something to the constitution which doesn't change something which is already in the constituion (example: last year's prop 8 decision which outlawed gay marriage) then all that is needed is a simply majority vote of the people on a proposition. It's stupid I know, but the fact is if you have the 1/3 veto in either house of the legislature then you have enough votes to block a change in the contitution like repealing the 2/3rds law. :crazy:

That was one of the reasons Republicans pushed for the 2/3rds law during the era where Republicans road Reagan's coat tails to virtual absolute power in the state. They recognized that most California's disagreed with their ideology and used the chance to rig a minority veto over everything knowing that they would soon return to the minority.

[Patroklos]

Why the hell is anyone worried about following propositions when the obviously are not paying any attention to the constitution itself?

[Dinner]

California iirc has about as large an economy as Germany but unfortunately they are almost completely lacking in Germans. (fiscal conservatives)

Germany's economy is larger (4rd largest in the world) while California is only 7th in the world. It used to be 5th but it fell in place through the 80's and 90's not because the state wasn't growing but because places like China and South Korea were growing faster.

[Dis]

sadly my state has taken to propositions alot lately, but nothing as bad as Cali's.

you just gotta hope they can pass some tax increases.

[Agathon]

Germany has one of the highest mean personal income tax rates in the world. Is this a new definition of fiscal conservatism?

[Dinner]

Ignore the props instead of the Constitution.

The props are given their power BY the Constitution.

[Dinner]

They should look in the mirror is they want someone to blame.

Hey, I agree ultimately constantly voting for spending increases while also voting to give yourself tax breaks is not good. It doesn't take a genius to figure out that is the path to financial ruin. That said the immediate cause is that Republicans are refusing to pass any budget which includes even a single tax increase even though if you eliminated all discretionary spending the budget would not be balanced. That's how far the economy has fallen in this recession so no matter what the state must raise taxes in order to fund voter mandated spending programs. It's the Republicans who refuse to recognize the basic fact that it is impossible to cut enough to balance the budget and it is Republicans who are refusing to pass any state budget. I'm very confident that Californians, being generally progressive people, will understand this fact and push Republicans accordingly.

Of course, given that virtually all state legislature districts are gerrymandered 75-25 splits (by both parties) that might not happen right away and we may, even likely, have to wait until 2012 when the first election without gerrymandered districts occurs. That day will bring a very rude awakening for extremists of both parties even though the majority of the state will no doubt continue to be progressive Democrats. Extremists who are used to safe districts they've held for 40 years will suddenly find districts 50-50 split (or at least closer to 50-50 splits) and they'll suddenly find people want moderates and not extremists.

[notyoueither]

So?

Your Constitution mandates two contradictory things.

Choose.

[Agathon]

How is this ever going to resolve itself, Oerdin? I heard that the districts are so gerrymandered in California so as to ensure that the Republicans will always have enough seats to prevent a tax increase.

Is that true?

Isn't the prospect of a non-gerrymandered election next to impossible?

At least you guys still have the beach.