Canada's coup d'etat: Opposition parties join to overthrow gov't (Part 2)

[Asher]

Originally posted by CrONoS
There is no possibility that BQ will accept being in a federal government coalition.

There is no ****ing way it happen.

Uhh

They've already signed the papers

[CrONoS]

Originally posted by Asher


Uhh

They've already signed the papers

1) I was talking in an election;

2) In the actual coalition government:
The BQ doesn't have any ministry; he basically supported the creation of the coalition in order to topple down the conservatives gov. The principal action of the BQ will be to vote on the non trust motion. If the coalition become the government, they will be mainly forced to vote with the government.

[Garth Vader]

Originally posted by Asher


You're very mistaken if you think most Canadians would vote for the Bloc in any way.

Why do you think even the Liberals-NDP didn't form their coalition before the election? They knew the Tories would win and they didn't even team up then. They knew they had a better chance ganging up on the government once the election was over.

We wouldn't be voting for the Bloc we would still be voting for our MP, who around here would probably be an NDP. It's like saying that a Reform/PC merger couldn't happen because Ontarions, or Quebekers would never vote Reform. The Reform types ran in the west, the PC's ran in the east.

[Fake Boris]

Originally posted by KrazyHorse
Can you imagine Harper NOT making hay out of this every day until the next general election?

Realistically speaking, Harper can't get the seats in Quebec required for a majority, if he takes that path.

He's got a hot potato stuck in his mouth.

[Flubber]

Originally posted by Asher
It's patently irresponsible to name a lame duck leader who just set a record for worst election result as Prime Minister of the country.

Asher-- that is simply opinion

The contrary view is "it is patently unreasonable to have a leader who was supported by a minority of Canadians and whio is vehemently opposed by the majority of the legislature and cannot pass any of his proposed measures"

While I can agree with some of the sentiments you are expressing, the question to me is simple-- Forget the particulars of the people involved - the question is this

IN the Canadian system should a coalition of co-operating parties with the support of a majority of MPs be permitted to form a government over the objections of the largest party?

Forget the players involved and what offends you about this and all the other political stuff and I think you have to answer the question yes. I as canadian politics gets increasingly multi-party, we may see more coalition governments as time passes and I think it has to be that any grouping that can obtain a majority should be allowed to govern.

Otherwise we would be doomed to perpetual elections or a requirement that the largest party is "the government" despite a very real inability to govern.


I can understand analysis and comments based on the near-offensiveness of a chosen coalition partner BUT with all due respect, bloc members are as entitled to be part of government as anyone else. The fact that they have a stated aim to dismantle the country MUST be irrelevant to the right


There is a lot in this proposed coalition I disagree with but just as if Canada had elected a majority government I disliked, this is part of democracy. My view may be that this government will be atrocious but I think this is irrelevant again to the right of the majority of MPs to combine to form a majority to govern.

[Fake Boris]

Originally posted by Asher
2) How is it a lie when it is clear that the Bloc is pivotal to having a majority coalition? How does one feign rage so convincingly about a perceived "lie" and then lie in response to it? Does he not comprehend the ramifications of his coalition, or is he just a really good liar?

Sigh.

The only compromises granted to the Bloc concern the economy and some welfare programs. It's ****ing written down.

The Bloc specifically rejected to support the coalition for more than 18 months because no deal could be reached on issues of constitution or national unity.

Go ahead, talk to us about Dion's —the father of the Clarity Bill— hidden separatist agenda.

[Asher]

Originally posted by Oncle Boris


Realistically speaking, Harper can't get the seats in Quebec required for a majority, if he takes that path.

He's got a hot potato stuck in his mouth.

He doesn't require a single seat in Quebec for a majority. He only needs 12 seats for a majority, which he can get elsewhere.

Get off yourself, your province sucks.

[Asher]

Originally posted by Oncle Boris


Sigh.

The only compromises granted to the Bloc concern the economy and some welfare programs. It's ****ing written down.

This is a bald-faced lie. Shame on you.

It is very clear that there is also some non-defined private "consultation mechanism" for the BQ to influence the government.

And I never claimed Dion had a hidden separatist agenda. Just that he is compromising on his most integral values to grab power, which is absolutely shameful and not becoming of a leader for our country.

[Fake Boris]

Asher sinks lower by posting the dumbest editorial I've read in months.

As blogger Ezra Levant noted this week: “A permanent consultation mechanism, you say? Well, we already have one of those — it’s called Parliament. But Parliament is a little too public for this coalition — you know, with nosy Canadians watching how deals are made. This consultation mechanism will be private — a way for the separatists to make their demands in secret, and for prime minister Stéphane Dion to meet those demands in secret.”

Yes indeed assclown. A government caucus is known to discuss orientations and strategy in Parliament.

wow

[Asher]

Originally posted by Oncle Boris
Asher sinks lower by posting the dumbest editorial I've read in months.

As blogger Ezra Levant noted this week: “A permanent consultation mechanism, you say? Well, we already have one of those — it’s called Parliament. But Parliament is a little too public for this coalition — you know, with nosy Canadians watching how deals are made. This consultation mechanism will be private — a way for the separatists to make their demands in secret, and for prime minister Stéphane Dion to meet those demands in secret.”

Yes indeed assclown. A government caucus is known to discuss orientations and strategy in Parliament.

wow

It's not dumb if you can't comprehend it. The Bloc can at any point pull the plug on this government. The consultation sessions, which Dion must agree to, will serve as ways for the Bloc to make their "requests" to the government. How much do you want to bet Quebec gets a disproportionate share of this "economic stimulus" they're throwing around?

I don't think you comprehend the ramifications of the basic concepts being discussed.

[Fake Boris]

Originally posted by Asher


It's not dumb if you can't comprehend it. The Bloc can at any point pull the plug on this government. The consultation sessions, which Dion must agree to, will serve as ways for the Bloc to make their "requests" to the government. How much do you want to bet Quebec gets a disproportionate share of this "economic stimulus" they're throwing around?

I don't think you comprehend the ramifications of the basic concepts being discussed.

No, you don't comprehend the dynamics at play. The influence of the Bloc in this coalition would be limited. They're not likely to get more than already agreed.

If the Libs give the Bloc too much, they're commiting political suicide - not only in Quebec, but also in Canada (albeit for different reasons).

Duceppe understands that, and also reckons that voters expect a government to be viable for a decent amount of time. And in any case, his party has no cash for the moment, so he has to wait before he triggers an election.

Thanks for buying into the knee-jerk SEPARATISM=666 reaction, you're making my comic relief.

[Fake Boris]

The funnier part about the National Post piece, of course, is that they supported Harper, even though he's been the most secretive leader in recent history.

But yeah, a government should invite 200 journalists and television crew to its caucus meetings.

[Asher]

Originally posted by Oncle Boris

No, you don't comprehend the dynamics at play. The influence of the Bloc in this coalition would be limited.

How the hell can it be limited? Without the Bloc's support, the coalition loses confidence and fails out immediately.

[Asher]

Originally posted by Oncle Boris
The funnier part about the National Post piece, of course, is that they supported Harper, even though he's been the most secretive leader in recent history.

But yeah, a government should invite 200 journalists and television crew to its caucus meetings.

It's one thing to have private meetings between parties who support the government of Canada, it's quite another to have secretive meetings with parties that want to destroy Canada.

[Flubber]

Originally posted by Oncle Boris


Sigh.

The only compromises granted to the Bloc concern the economy and some welfare programs. It's ****ing written down.

The Bloc specifically rejected to support the coalition for more than 18 months because no deal could be reached on issues of constitution or national unity.

Go ahead, talk to us about Dion's —the father of the Clarity Bill— hidden separatist agenda.

To be fair to Asher it is tough to believe they have written down the complete agreement of what must happen for the Bloc to support this government for periods of months and months. That is completely unrealistic. THe interesting thing would be if some completely divisive issue comes up in the first few months. The Conservatives will be busily attempting to ascertain such issues I am sure