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Canada's Opposition Parties Vow to Bring Down Government, 1 month into its term...

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  • #61
    From Reuters

    OTTAWA (Reuters) - Canada's minority government teetered on the edge of collapse on Friday, less than two months after its re-election, as opposition parties talked of forming a coalition to replace the ruling Conservatives.
    ...


    reuters.com
    http://ca.reuters.com/article/topNews/idCATRE4AR3VF20081128


    Nope. No chaos there. Or does Reuters have it wrong as well?
    "I have never killed a man, but I have read many obituaries with great pleasure." - Clarence Darrow
    "I didn't attend the funeral, but I sent a nice letter saying I approved of it." - Mark Twain

    Comment

    • #62
      Originally posted by Wezil
      From Reuters

      OTTAWA (Reuters) - Canada's minority government teetered on the edge of collapse on Friday, less than two months after its re-election, as opposition parties talked of forming a coalition to replace the ruling Conservatives.
      ...


      reuters.com
      http://ca.reuters.com/article/topNews/idCATRE4AR3VF20081128


      Nope. No chaos there. Or does Reuters have it wrong as well?
      Oh, no doubt about it...the government was in chaos, but not by what Harper proposed...it was the Liberals and the NDP and Bloc that threatened its stability with their tantrum and empty threats.
      "The issue is there are still many people out there that use religion as a crutch for bigotry and hate. Like Ben."
      Ben Kenobi: "That means I'm doing something right. "

      Comment

      • #63


        Alright. You believe that.

        This was entirely caused by the Conservatives. All Harper had to do was play nice with 1 of the opposition parties but he just couldn't bring himself to do it. Instead he chose to stick a finger in all their eyes and you think the ensuing bruhaha was their fault. Okay. You are delusional.
        "I have never killed a man, but I have read many obituaries with great pleasure." - Clarence Darrow
        "I didn't attend the funeral, but I sent a nice letter saying I approved of it." - Mark Twain

        Comment

        • #64
          Originally posted by Wezil


          Alright. You believe that.
          Removing public ad and convention money from ALL parties doesn't throw the government into Chaos. This is what the conservatives did.

          Threatening to bring down a 6-week old government because you're incompetent at private fundraising, now that is what throws the government into chaos.

          You can blame the conservatives for that if you wish, but that's kind of like blaming a rape victim for flirting with her attacker. The chaos, like the crime in the rape case, happens in the response.
          "The issue is there are still many people out there that use religion as a crutch for bigotry and hate. Like Ben."
          Ben Kenobi: "That means I'm doing something right. "

          Comment

          • #65
            Your analogy fails. The conservatives are the "victims"?

            How about this -

            If we ever meet I shall kick you in the balls. If you respond negatively it is your fault.

            edit - actually, I would need to kick you, your SO, and one of your friends. As a group I expect you to take it and carry on.
            "I have never killed a man, but I have read many obituaries with great pleasure." - Clarence Darrow
            "I didn't attend the funeral, but I sent a nice letter saying I approved of it." - Mark Twain

            Comment

            • #66
              Originally posted by Wezil
              Your analogy fails. The conservatives are the "victims"?

              How about this -

              If we ever meet I shall kick you in the balls. If you respond negatively it is your fault.
              I'd just kick your ass and call it even. But your analogy fails. You forget that the conservatives are affected by their policy more than everyone else, they lose out on $10M to compared to about $6M for the Liberals. In real terms, this actually puts the Liberals closer to the conservatives in funding.

              No, you're portraying this like the conservatives are taking away just the money of the opposition. They're losing more than the opposition. That's a key point.

              So a better analogy is DanQ decides to stop offering free Poly access due to dramatically falling ad revenue making the site unsustainable, and you decide to DDoS the site in a fit of rage because you can't make enough money to spend a couple bucks a month on the site. Then you blame DanQ because he made you do it by making you mad.
              "The issue is there are still many people out there that use religion as a crutch for bigotry and hate. Like Ben."
              Ben Kenobi: "That means I'm doing something right. "

              Comment

              • #67
                Originally posted by Wezil
                Your analogy fails. The conservatives are the "victims"?

                How about this -

                If we ever meet I shall kick you in the balls. If you respond negatively it is your fault.

                edit - actually, I would need to kick you, your SO, and one of your friends. As a group I expect you to take it and carry on.
                If you ever mention my SO again in this kind of context, I will kick your ass. Really.
                "The issue is there are still many people out there that use religion as a crutch for bigotry and hate. Like Ben."
                Ben Kenobi: "That means I'm doing something right. "

                Comment

                • #68
                  The C's lose more in real $$ but considerably less as a % of total funds. This would cause the C's pain but would cripple all the others. You know this fact. Be honest.
                  "I have never killed a man, but I have read many obituaries with great pleasure." - Clarence Darrow
                  "I didn't attend the funeral, but I sent a nice letter saying I approved of it." - Mark Twain

                  Comment

                  • #69
                    Originally posted by Asher


                    If you ever mention my SO again in this kind of context, I will kick your ass. Really.
                    Get over yourself. You know the comment wasn't personal. I wouldn't do that.
                    "I have never killed a man, but I have read many obituaries with great pleasure." - Clarence Darrow
                    "I didn't attend the funeral, but I sent a nice letter saying I approved of it." - Mark Twain

                    Comment

                    • #70
                      Originally posted by Wezil
                      The C's lose more in real $$ but considerably less as a % of total funds.
                      Since when did parties book convention halls and make sleazy dishonest ads and run them 10000 times a day with "% of total funds" as opposed to real money?

                      You're being dishonest now...
                      "The issue is there are still many people out there that use religion as a crutch for bigotry and hate. Like Ben."
                      Ben Kenobi: "That means I'm doing something right. "

                      Comment

                      • #71
                        Originally posted by Wezil


                        Get over yourself. You know the comment wasn't personal. I wouldn't do that.
                        It makes me uncomfortable to bring him in these kinds of conversations in that kind of context. It's unnecessary. Not to mention the fact that it was completely stupid (are you saying the Liberals are to the NDP what I am to my SO?). That's either outrageously offensive or outrageously stupid, take your pick.
                        "The issue is there are still many people out there that use religion as a crutch for bigotry and hate. Like Ben."
                        Ben Kenobi: "That means I'm doing something right. "

                        Comment

                        • #72
                          Originally posted by Asher


                          Since when did parties book convention halls and make sleazy dishonest ads and run them 10000 times a day with "% of total funds" as opposed to real money?

                          You're being dishonest now...
                          WTF?

                          What the parties choose to do with the money they have is pretty much up to them. We're talking about how much they get to start with. Conservatives can rely quite nicely on grassroots donations (credit to them) whereas the other parties cannot.
                          "I have never killed a man, but I have read many obituaries with great pleasure." - Clarence Darrow
                          "I didn't attend the funeral, but I sent a nice letter saying I approved of it." - Mark Twain

                          Comment

                          • #73
                            Originally posted by Wezil


                            WTF?
                            Shocking, I know! But they don't go up to convention halls and offer them "12.5% of our total funds" for the hall, they offer, say, $20,000. Real money! Not percentages of total funds, which is why the "BUT THE PERCENTAGESS!!" argument is for the math-challenged.

                            What the parties choose to do with the money they have is pretty much up to them. We're talking about how much they get to start with. Conservatives can rely quite nicely on grassroots donations (credit to them) whereas the other parties cannot.
                            Care to explain why the other parties cannot?
                            "The issue is there are still many people out there that use religion as a crutch for bigotry and hate. Like Ben."
                            Ben Kenobi: "That means I'm doing something right. "

                            Comment

                            • #74
                              Originally posted by Asher


                              It makes me uncomfortable to bring him in these kinds of conversations in that kind of context. It's unnecessary. Not to mention the fact that it was completely stupid (are you saying the Liberals are to the NDP what I am to my SO?). That's either outrageously offensive or outrageously stupid, take your pick.
                              Relax. I need three people with testicles that's all. Substitute 3 workers in the local grocery if it makes you more comfortable.
                              "I have never killed a man, but I have read many obituaries with great pleasure." - Clarence Darrow
                              "I didn't attend the funeral, but I sent a nice letter saying I approved of it." - Mark Twain

                              Comment

                              • #75
                                To clarify the "% of funds" vs "raw money" argument:

                                All of the major parties run candidates in virtually all the ridings and are vying for the same ad times and locations.

                                So let's say the conservatives, being competent, raise $40M privately. The Liberals, being Dion's party, raise $20M privately. The NDP, being led by a leader with personality, raise $25M privately.

                                This would mean right now, the conservatives can out-spend the liberals by $20M (note: these are made up numbers).

                                The conservatives lose about $10M with this motion, while the liberals only lose about $6M.

                                That means the gap between the conservatives and liberals is now only $16M instead of $20M.

                                IT IS THE END OF DEMOCRACY. Everyone is buying less ads (THANK GOD) and the conservatives have $4M less ads to buy to bury the Liberals with.
                                "The issue is there are still many people out there that use religion as a crutch for bigotry and hate. Like Ben."
                                Ben Kenobi: "That means I'm doing something right. "

                                Comment

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