Norwegian law is global

[Chemical Ollie]

Originally posted by onodera
I mean aged between 15 and 18, which are the ages of consent in Thailand and most of the US respectively.

This makes things interesting, if true. If I'm not completely wrong, legal age of consent differs quite a bit between different states in the US. Let's say it's 16 in one state and 18 in the next. Can they also prosecute a person who has an affair with a 17 YO in a state where that is legal, even if everything happens on "the right side" of the state border? If no, why do it if it happens in Asia?

[Sirotnikov]

Re: Norwegian law is global

Originally posted by Chemical Ollie
What I find absurd about his law is not the sex trade thing, that is a minor question, but the fact that the lawmakers believe that other nations are not capable of making laws for their own territory.

I think that it is exactly the classification of buying sex as an offense that makes this law absurd.

The problem is that there is no wide-accepted consensus on paid sex being an offense. This is something pushed onto a public by coalitions of people with certain views, but it is not something that is standard.

You often do have local laws that can get you in jail even if what you do is not an offense in a foreign country.

For instance, If you commit an act of treason abroad, you'll still get arrested when you come to your country, even though you didn't break foreign laws.

If you go to be a mercenary in a foreign country, you might get arrested, even though you didn't break foreign country laws (especially in lawless places of the world).

If you were a criminal in a different country but wasn't caught or suspected, and then you come with your laundered money back to your country, you can be arrested.


The problem is with the specificness of this law, that not only is not global, but apparently there's a large enough percentage of Norwegians and Swedes who disagree with their local laws, and go get their paid sex elsewhere.

[Chemical Ollie]

Re: Re: Norwegian law is global

Originally posted by Sirotnikov
---
For instance, If you commit an act of treason abroad, you'll still get arrested when you come to your country, even though you didn't break foreign laws.

If you are a member of the uniformed services, national laws apply even when you are stationed abroad, if you think of espionage etc. It is also already illegal for Swedish military personnel to buy sexual services when on foreign missions. But I hardly think that's controversial, as it's a part of the employment contract.

What is an act of treason for a civilian in peace time? (In times of war, civil laws goes out the window, and I think most people have understanding of that, that's another discussion.)

If you go to be a mercenary in a foreign country, you might get arrested, even though you didn't break foreign country laws (especially in lawless places of the world).

I don't think being a mercenary is a crime by itself, at least not here. But commiting war crimes while being a mercenary is illegal by international law, in which case you can be prosecuted.

If you were a criminal in a different country but wasn't caught or suspected, and then you come with your laundered money back to your country, you can be arrested. ---

If an act is illegal in the country where it's committed, that's the case, naturally. But if it's legal, then arresting you when you return home would be absurd. Let's assume gambling is illegal in your home country. Then you go to Las Vegas on holiday and win a huge Jack Pot. Are you now a criminal in your home country?

[Monk]

Re: Re: Re: Norwegian law is global

Originally posted by Chemical Ollie
If an act is illegal in the country where it's committed, that's the case, naturally. But if it's legal, then arresting you when you return home would be absurd. Let's assume gambling is illegal in your home country. Then you go to Las Vegas on holiday and win a huge Jack Pot. Are you now a criminal in your home country?

Sure, but on the other hand - let's say I want to circumcise my daughter and I take her to some jurisdiction that doesn't care. Surely you don't think I should get away with that just because I happened to be at the 'right' place.

[Chemical Ollie]

Re: Re: Re: Re: Norwegian law is global

Originally posted by Monk


Sure, but on the other hand - let's say I want to circumcise my daughter and I take her to some jurisdiction that doesn't care. Surely you don't think I should get away with that just because I happened to be at the 'right' place.

I haven't studied exactly how those laws are written, but you can go around the problem by making it illegal to transfer your daughter out of the country in order to circumsice her. Then the crime would be committed in the country where the law was written.

[Cort Haus]

Originally posted by Dauphin
There are similar English laws like that, but I think they are civil in nature.

Will check up when I get a chance.

Our draconian, authoritarian and imperialistic libel laws spring to mind (though doubtless you will disagree with me on some technicality ).

When a USAian author publishes a book accusing certain Saudis of terror, and said Saudis sue the author in a British court because 30 copies were bought here via Amazon, British law presumes to impose a fine on the author against all sovereign, moral and legal common sense.

British libel laws

[Sirotnikov]

Ollie - you missed my point.

Things like like uniformed service law, and "international" law are already precedents for laws that apply regardless of territorial whereabouts.

It is my claim that there is nothing new in laws that ignore physical whereabouts or even the relation of the victim of offense to the country.

The problem is with the fact that territorial boundaries are ignored on a law that is of local nature, and not a universal thing (like murder, or stealing).

Going to hookers is not a crime. Being a hooker is not a crime too.

Sex slavery exists much thanks to market failure and very oppressive government intervention in the wrong direction. Instead of regulating it and helping keeping everyone's rights, the government tries to ban a natural human phenomena.

[Chemical Ollie]

Originally posted by Sirotnikov
Ollie - you missed my point.

Things like like uniformed service law, and "international" law are already precedents for laws that apply regardless of territorial whereabouts.

It is my claim that there is nothing new in laws that ignore physical whereabouts or even the relation of the victim of offense to the country.

The problem is with the fact that territorial boundaries are ignored on a law that is of local nature, and not a universal thing (like murder, or stealing).

I didn't start this thread to discuss the justification of sex trade laws, I'm fully aware that the Scandinavian Feminazis are already controversial around the world. I don't support those *****es, but they are the majority in a democracy, so there is nothing to do about them. I fully accept the Swedish sex trade law, as it affects me as little as the law against killing Wolfs. (I don´t even own a rifle).

But I want to continue the discussion about the geographic vality of laws. Laws for severe crimes are global, that is not controversial if we talk murder, heavy theafth etc. And that's not what we are discussing. Those laws are global and everybody knows it. The same goes for breaches against employment contract for uniformed services. What's new about the Norwegian sex trade law is that a minor local law goes global. That has never happened before, and I don't think we should accept that it does. If we let it go, they can use it as precedent for further dictatorship.

[TCO]

What if you travel with your slave into Minnesota? Does he become free?

[Sirotnikov]

What's new about the Norwegian sex trade law is that a minor local law goes global. That has never happened before, and I don't think we should accept that it does. If we let it go, they can use it as precedent for further dictatorship.

Well in that case I agree partially.

A country can set laws for its citizens that are sort of global.

If I take legal drugs in another country, Israel could technically not like that. I have no idea how the actual law goes.

But the thing is that I would only get arrested if I go back to Israel and if the authorities know.

I know that I can gamble in other countries while gambling in Israel is forbidden.

Sometimes however there are laws that are enacted on foreign issues if they can prove a person is a certain type of criminal.

For instance, Israeli police performs lots of background checks on russian immigrants, on their russian busineses. Lots of time they would make money in different schemes that are officially legal but are in the grey zone.

Those would certainly be prosecuted or at least kept from certain activities.

Someone who tries to buy a company property or get a political office will usually get a better background check, and will be prevented from office even if his actions were officially legal, or he was suspected but never pressed charges against.