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Want elite humans?
Send them to the US Marines.
Send them to the US Marines.
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You can't be elite if you're trained not to think.Originally posted by ramseya
Want elite humans?
Send them to the US Marines."The issue is there are still many people out there that use religion as a crutch for bigotry and hate. Like Ben."
Ben Kenobi: "That means I'm doing something right. "Comment
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Asher:
and from Inc Magazine:The SULE course consists of a series of obstacles that require Marine officer candidates to think as a team and overcome barriers that require more than just physical strength. One of the SULE problems calls for hauling a nearly 200-pound dummy and weighted ammo cans up a steep slope without exposing team members to enemy fire. If someone pokes his head above the shallow ridge that flanks the path to the top of a small rise, they have to restart.
Another requires patience. Teams must move a pair of heavy metal pipes — intended to simulate “Bangalore torpedoes” — across a shaky rope bridge that includes sections candidates must avoid touching — or they have to restart.
The point isn’t necessarily to complete the problem in the time given. But the candidates don’t know that. Being under the gun is just another part of the leadership lessons the SULE courses are intended to teach. Evaluators are looking to see how a potential officer will perform under pressure to complete a complex and ambiguous task.
Thinking quickly on your feet is a critical prerequisite for all officers and NCO's.Comment
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That sounds just as useless as the team-building **** most companies waste time with.
I'm happy that every now and then Marines need to do something requiring basic thought, but it really does pale in comparison to the kind of thinking you need to do in a far more cerebral world.
Thinking quickly on your feat is important, but the Marines are far from the best place to gain that skill. In fact, the rigid command structure of the Marines encourages obedience over original thought in most cases."The issue is there are still many people out there that use religion as a crutch for bigotry and hate. Like Ben."
Ben Kenobi: "That means I'm doing something right. "Comment
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And to think you were making fun of Gepap...I'm happy that every now and then Marines need to do something requiring basic thought, but it really does pale in comparison to the kind of thinking you need to do in a far more cerebral world.
Quite the opposite Asher. Not that that would mean they were not elite anyway given the definition. Stanley cup winners are elite, and we all know they don't or even can't think.Thinking quickly on your feat is important, but the Marines are far from the best place to gain that skill. In fact, the rigid command structure of the Marines encourages obedience over original thought in most cases."The DPRK is still in a state of war with the U.S. It's called a black out." - Che explaining why orbital nightime pictures of NK show few lights. Seriously.Comment
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Just how the **** is it "quite the opposite"? You're telling me the Marines are all about encouraging original thought versus obedience? I suppose that's why they let you wear whatever you like and do whatever you want whenever you want?Originally posted by Patroklos
And to think you were making fun of Gepap...
Quite the opposite Asher. Not that that would mean they were not elite anyway given the definition."The issue is there are still many people out there that use religion as a crutch for bigotry and hate. Like Ben."
Ben Kenobi: "That means I'm doing something right. "Comment
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Asher:
What about the Marines in the Intelligence, Counterintelligence, and Human Intelligence fields? Logistics? You think they don't do anything cerebral?
See this is exactly the type of crap I keep hearing from people who have never been in the military. I'll be going to OCS for the Marines in Oct. I graduated magna *** laude from college... other Marine candidates I've met have gone to schools like UPenn and other ivy league schools. Wharton has a strong relationship with the Marine Corps, admitting former Marines and sending MBA's over to OCS to observe the training.
Intelligence is definitely required to be an officer in the US military.Comment
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I'm sure they do, but it'd be no different than a civilian in an equivalent role.Originally posted by ramseya
Asher:
What about the Marines in the Intelligence, Counterintelligence, and Human Intelligence fields? Logistics? You think they don't do anything cerebral?
Sure. But it doesn't make them elite, or anything close to it.Intelligence is definitely required to be an officer in the US military."The issue is there are still many people out there that use religion as a crutch for bigotry and hate. Like Ben."
Ben Kenobi: "That means I'm doing something right. "Comment
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Your job doesn't have rules? Your boss doesn't exercise his/her power as it is available to them?Just how the **** is it "quite the opposite"? You're telling me the Marines are all about encouraging original thought versus obedience? I suppose that's why they let you wear whatever you like and do whatever you want whenever you want?
OH MY GOD I HAVE TO WEAR A PERSCRIBED UNIFORM FOR A DAMN GOOD REASON!!! You average Marine officer tackles unique work realted problems everyday that he is expected to overcome just like you, only sometimes in an enviroment totally different than you.
That's not what makes a Marine elite though. What makes him elite is that he performs in his field in a far superior fashion when compared to peers.
Are there any equivalent roles?I'm sure they do, but it'd be no different than a civilian in an equivalent role."The DPRK is still in a state of war with the U.S. It's called a black out." - Che explaining why orbital nightime pictures of NK show few lights. Seriously.Comment
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Well, if the thinking is limited to "how do I accomplish this task the most efficient way and please my masters and their goals" instead of actually having own ideas and .... well I guess it depends on the definition of elite.Originally posted by ramseya
Asher:
and from Inc Magazine:
Thinking quickly on your feet is a critical prerequisite for all officers and NCO's.Comment
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according to the original post from anessham:
Physically better-trained? DEFINITELY. Mentally more equipped? Than average? Sure. Able to handle the stress of a war? Yes. Emotionally more mature? You need to be to be able to get through boot camp.By elite, I mean a group of people who are physically better-trained, mentally more equipped, and emotionally more mature than the general population, and the distance between them and the general populace is large enough that at first glance there would appear to be a difference of type between them.
yeah Marines definitely fit the initial criteria.Comment
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Asher's just mad cause the Marines don't let openly gay Canadians into the Corps
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Is not incompatable with...Well, if the thinking is limited to "how do I accomplish this task the most efficient way and please my masters and their goals"
I suppose any scientist/politician/buisnessmen/athelete working for anyone to accomplish anything is not elite?actually having own ideas."The DPRK is still in a state of war with the U.S. It's called a black out." - Che explaining why orbital nightime pictures of NK show few lights. Seriously.Comment
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I'm largely independent. I work on a team. We gather requirements from the client, together we formulate an architecture, then I go off and do my modules. I design them how I want, when I want, etc. The "rules" are to give reasonable estimates and timelines and "do right by the client"...Originally posted by Patroklos
Your job doesn't have rules? Your boss doesn't exercise his/her power as it is available to them?
Yeah, like how to move where he's told?You average Marine officer tackles unique work realted problems everyday that he is expected to overcome just like you, only sometimes in an enviroment totally different than you.
I've no doubt there's some basic thought required, but to even pretend it's anywhere near the level of thought and analysis required by many people in the civilian world is just bizarre. Most Marines are footsoldiers...simple as that. You can spin "having to figure out how to cross a river" as "tackling unique problems", but we both know that's putting it nicely.
To:Are there any equivalent roles?
Intelligence, Counterintelligence, and Human Intelligence fields? Logistics?
Yes."The issue is there are still many people out there that use religion as a crutch for bigotry and hate. Like Ben."
Ben Kenobi: "That means I'm doing something right. "Comment
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You have to be completely stupid to compare the absolute rigidity of the command structure in the marines to that in the civilian world. Yes, we have managers. No, we don't kill people because our managers tell us to.Originally posted by Patroklos
Is not incompatable with...
I suppose any scientist/politician/buisnessmen/athelete working for anyone to accomplish anything is not elite?
The military is extremely obedience-heavy. There's a reason bootcamps are designed the way they were to foster such obedience, and there's a reason civilians don't have the same.
For instance: A marine is ordered to move from Point A to point B.
I am told "I need software to do this."
Now, compare and contrast the difference in level of original thought and thinking between the two tasks..."The issue is there are still many people out there that use religion as a crutch for bigotry and hate. Like Ben."
Ben Kenobi: "That means I'm doing something right. "Comment
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