Is A Revolution Possible In America?

[Victor Galis]

Originally posted by PLATO
Screw revolution...The South needs to secede again. The rest of ya'll can deal with northern created problems. The South can handle their own.

You're right, we could get rid of a whole lot of problems that way.

[Imran Siddiqui]

What exactly would the revolution's goal be? Socialist revolt? Too many people are well off enough that you wouldn't be able to get the manpower you'd need for that sort of thing.

Otherwise, if you are concerned about crooks in power... well, welcome to government.

[Victor Galis]

Maybe we can have an Iran-style theocracy

[Imran Siddiqui]

Too many people like their liquor and porn.

[DaShi]

I"m voting Republican to hasten the revolution.

[Deity Dude]

Originally posted by Arrian
Too many of us have far too much to lose. Things would have to change pretty dramatically for there to be the right atmosphere for revolution.

-Arrian

Then I guess the answer to the question would be; If the situation got bad enough where very very few had much to lose and very very many had nothing to lose.

The only way I could see that happening is if the economy got so bad that we had a super-depression. By that I mean way way worse than the 30's.

How could that happen? How about $20/gal gas. The entire infrastructure would start to crumble. It would raise the price of food and unemployment to such an extent that people would start to starve. If people start to starve they really aren't interested in some high or mighty political issue - they are worried about feeding themselves and their family. They would demand that government did something.

I assume at that point the government would be required to take resources thru whatever means possible - which would mean a major if not world war - or face local rebellions and general unrest.

Historically these are the usual conditions that lead to revolution or war in otherwise stable countries.

[Victor Galis]

Right... the US is nowhere near that point even if it's in trouble.

[Arrian]

Originally posted by Deity Dude

Then I guess the answer to the question would be; If the situation got bad enough where very very few had much to lose and very very many had nothing to lose.

The only way I could see that happening is if the economy got so bad that we had a super-depression. By that I mean way way worse than the 30's.

How could that happen? How about $20/gal gas. The entire infrastructure would start to crumble. It would raise the price of food and unemployment to such an extent that people would start to starve. If people start to starve they really aren't interested in some high or mighty political issue - they are worried about feeding themselves and their family. They would demand that government did something.

I assume at that point the government would be required to take resources thru whatever means possible - which would mean a major if not world war - or face local rebellions and general unrest.

Historically these are the usual conditions that lead to revolution or war in otherwise stable countries.

Enacting "fair trade" tarrifs would probably do the trick.

The resulting trade war would cause a huge depression. People, who had been told that the law would benifit them, would be very, very angry. Nothing is worse than raising expectations and then dashing them.

-Arrian

[MikeH]

Originally posted by rah
Of course it's my belief that the poor are too lazy to revolt. Which is why most of them are poor. Yes, I know there are exceptions.

Exceptions? People being poor because they are lazy is the exception

You don't think it's much more likely that you'll end up poor if you are born poor, go to **** schools, have terrible nutrition, no healthcare, bad parental examples (if any), live in a high crime, high drug neighbourhood than if you start off in a nice middle class neighbourhood, with a decent school, health insurance, couple of well meaning parents and a small college fund? I'm in the second camp, and because of that I never really had to work hard for anything in my life. I'm doing pretty well despite being lazy.

What about all those poor people working their asses off doing 2 or 3 jobs to make ends meet, doing their best for their kids but still totally poor because they have no qualifications, and unable to get any because they are working 2 or 3 jobs and have kids to look after?

Seriously, poor people are poor because they are lazy? It's hard to be lazy if you don't know where the money for the next meal is coming from and you've got dozens of people ready to take your ****ty minimum wage job if you don't perform.

[Arrian]

Well said, Mike.

-Arrian

[Lorizael]

Poor people shouldn't have children.

[rah]

While hard work is no guarentee for success, it sure helps. Hard work will overcome many of the obstacles that you listed. Look at the kids in the poor areas that work hard in school despite those handicaps. A good percentage of them are offered scholarships.

I've worked miminum pay jobs, I've had periods where I wasn't sure where the next meal was coming from. Those times inspired me to work harder.

While our family was poor when I was born I do have to admit that things were much better by the time we were teens. My father's father died when my dad was 7. He grew up dirt poor and joined the military to get an education, and worked 3 jobs to help support his mother. His hard work eventually paid off.

I'll take hard work over a sense of entitlement every time.

[Theben]

Originally posted by Arrian
Nothing is worse than raising expectations and then dashing them.

-Arrian

A major cause of the Watts riots in '68.

[PLATO]

Originally posted by rah
While hard work is no guarentee for success, it sure helps. Hard work will overcome many of the obstacles that you listed. Look at the kids in the poor areas that work hard in school despite those handicaps. A good percentage of them are offered scholarships.

I've worked miminum pay jobs, I've had periods where I wasn't sure where the next meal was coming from. Those times inspired me to work harder.

While our family was poor when I was born I do have to admit that things were much better by the time we were teens. My father's father died when my dad was 7. He grew up dirt poor and joined the military to get an education, and worked 3 jobs to help support his mother. His hard work eventually paid off.

I'll take hard work over a sense of entitlement every time.

Well said.

Additionally, poor people tend to allocate their time incorrectly. Is it really a benefit to them to work that second job just so their kid can have a playstation? Would they not be better served by getting some training or education with that time and living a little closer to the vest for a year or two so they could get a better job?

Of course, it is much easier to whine about your neighborhood, or poor upbringing and keep that after hours janitorial job, isn't it?

I have sympathy for poor people, but not when they don't take advantage of the plethora of programs designed to help them change their plight.

[Lorizael]

Originally posted by PLATO
Is it really a benefit to them to work that second job just so their kid can have a playstation? Would they not be better served by getting some training or education with that time and living a little closer to the vest for a year or two so they could get a better job?

No, they would be better served by not having children. Few expenses are greater; the investment rarely pays off; overpopulation is enough of a problem as it is; and poor people are likely to raise children who will remain poor, because the system into which they are born is seriously flawed.

(My post is in no way meant to contradict your point that poor people should get training or education and spend more frugally. I just think they should do that well before they decide to have (or accidentally have) children.)