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  • #76
    Is it ok according to American laws for Kremlin to finance a political party in US Congress?


    I'm pretty the answer is yes.

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    • #77
      The Clinton's made it clear that it is OK for the PRC to finance campaigns.
      I make no bones about my moral support for [terrorist] organizations. - chegitz guevara
      For those who aspire to live in a high cost, high tax, big government place, our nation and the world offers plenty of options. Vermont, Canada and Venezuela all offer you the opportunity to live in the socialist, big government paradise you long for. –Senator Rubio

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      • #78
        Originally posted by Kuciwalker
        Is it ok according to American laws for Kremlin to finance a political party in US Congress?


        I'm pretty the answer is yes.
        And I'm pretty sure the answer is no.

        You don't even allow foreign observers to monitor your elections. Democrats, my ass.

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        • #79
          The day after tommorow for the first time in my life I will vote for Putin, not for Commies as I usually do.
          And you know why? Because he pisses you off. If a Russian leader pisses the West off that means he leads Russia into the right direction. Russia has no allies except Russian army and Russian fleet (c). Alexander III.
          You don't need strong and prosperous Russia, you preffer to see continious Eltsin's-type anarchy here. No way, sirs. We will decide what is good for Russia, what parties will be in our parliament and who will be our president not you. So you can pretty much **** yourself and leave us alone.

          Have a nice day.

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          • #80
            THEY!!111 OMG WTF LOL LET DA NOMADS AND TEH S3D3NTARY PEOPLA BOTH MAEK BITER AXP3REINCES
            AND TEH GRAAT SINS OF THERE [DOCTRINAL] INOVATIONS BQU3ATH3D SMAL
            AND!!1!11!!! LOL JUST IN CAES A DISPUTANT CALS U 2 DISPUT3 ABOUT THEYRE CLAMES
            DO NOT THAN DISPUT3 ON THEM 3XCAPT BY WAY OF AN 3XTARNAL DISPUTA!!!!11!! WTF

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            • #81
              Serb ftw

              Spec.
              -Never argue with an idiot; He will bring you down to his level and beat you with experience.

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              • #82
                I'd vote for Putin too. Not because he pisses off the west, that's just silly. No, I'd vote for him because I'm too old for the draft and there's nothing on TV.
                Long time member @ Apolyton
                Civilization player since the dawn of time

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                • #83
                  In many Russian wars you are not too old.
                  (\__/)
                  (='.'=)
                  (")_(") This is Bunny. Copy and paste bunny into your signature to help him gain world domination.

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                  • #84
                    Originally posted by Serb

                    And I'm pretty sure the answer is no.

                    You don't even allow foreign observers to monitor your elections. Democrats, my ass.
                    Bush changed it; which was very undemocratic of him and indicative of his disregard for setting a good example.
                    Try http://wordforge.net/index.php for discussion and debate.

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                    • #85
                      There has been a demand for "Russian democracy is now destroyed!"-kind of news for the last 8 years or so. BBC news is now dutifully fulfilling that demand by trying to spin routine technical changes into fraud-filled elections. Since there is a demand for such news among the only Americans who seem genuinely interested in the domestic affairs of Russia -- neo-cons who were naïve liberals in the 60s and 70s and are now still living in the early 80s when they woke up -- what really happens will not matter at all.

                      This is the 7th year in a row when I'm reading how Putin is now destroying democracy and installing himself as a dictator. Yet, parliamentary election rules are still enforced, and they're still much more democratic than they're in most other European countries (I recommend Americans to take to read about the French parliamentary election model as an example). I'm not holding my breath.

                      Comment


                      • #86
                        Originally posted by GePap
                        And yet the mayority of Russians would vote to re-elect Putin if they could.

                        Why are Liberals around the world so utterly incapable of talking in a way that addresses the fears and desires of the masses?

                        All one hears is preachyness about "values", but your average individual voters cares more about "Do I have a job, can I feed my family, can I be left alone in peace?" than they do the value of a multi-party democracy. That is why demagoges and autocrats with money win democratically all the time, and will continue to in countries were the Liberals are good enough to preach about values but never seemingly good enough to get the benefits through to those who might form some sort of effective middle class.
                        I don't get it - do you or do you not support curtailing of forming preelection coalitions, jailing of opposition candidates and virtuall monopolisation of broadcast media in the hands of the Government?
                        Originally posted by Serb:Please, remind me, how exactly and when exactly, Russia bullied its neighbors?
                        Originally posted by Ted Striker:Go Serb !
                        Originally posted by Pekka:If it was possible to capture the essentials of Sepultura in a dildo, I'd attach it to a bicycle and ride it up your azzes.

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                        • #87
                          US did screw up with the foreign observers in their election though. That is quite true.

                          However, as someone who opposes that and also lives outside both Russia and US, it's time for the rest of the world (that is me) to tell you guys that you both suck with elections. You both suck ass. It's like that God hates fags dude and Bin Laden arguing whose ideology is worse. It's like guys, you both suck ass with these election things and yes, you're fighting for the last place outside places like Pakistan and other regions where power is just outright taken by strongmen.

                          Let's say it one more time and make it 3 times, you both suck at election thingies and you keep pointing at each other and to us arrogant and snobby foreigners it seems quite hilarious indeed.

                          HA-HA!

                          There. I said it.

                          And both use fundamentally the same argument.

                          US: "We do these things right, you can trust us. Listen buddy, it's just not worth of your effort, we have legitimate problems with these foreigners trying to create a mess by claiming things dind't go OK, it's all political, so we're trying to just kind of... listen, they're the problem, we do it right so trust us. We're just not allowing these agenda having foreigners to put their spin on it."

                          Russia: "ME STRONG! We can't let these weak little ****ers to come and push their agenda. The time for outside influence is over, they've poisoned us and now they are afraid because we are uniting and we must continue to disregard outside poisoners."

                          The world seems so scary to both in VERY SPESIFIC ways related to certain time and space. I personally find it odd. Others might call it straight out gangsta and undemocratic. Oh well.
                          In da butt.
                          "Do not worry if others do not understand you. Instead worry if you do not understand others." - Confucius
                          THE UNDEFEATED SUPERCITIZEN w:4 t:2 l:1 (DON'T ASK!)
                          "God is dead" - Nietzsche. "Nietzsche is dead" - God.

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                          • #88
                            Originally posted by Saras


                            I don't get it - do you or do you not support curtailing of forming preelection coalitions, jailing of opposition candidates and virtuall monopolisation of broadcast media in the hands of the Government?
                            banning pre-election coolitions is a technical rule, and has nothing to do with "ending democracy", specially since one can have a democracy without a parlimentary system.

                            Jailing opposition candidates and an unfairt media are certainly undemocratic, but the fact is that even with an independent media in Russia (a country not known for the trust people give government, now is it?) Putin and his allies would still win. What does the opposition offer other than fear of more Putin rule? (Which a lot of Russians would approve off?)
                            If you don't like reality, change it! me
                            "Oh no! I am bested!" Drake
                            "it is dangerous to be right when the government is wrong" Voltaire
                            "Patriotism is a pernecious, psychopathic form of idiocy" George Bernard Shaw

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                            • #89
                              The things about people's rule (democracy) is that most people would want best a democracy where if in the majority, they got what the majority wanted, aka, an unliberal democracy. One has to convincingly argue to individuals why a Liberal democracy is what they should aim for, and why it is a benefit directly to them - demagogues can easily make the case for illiberal democracy, Liberals seem currently unable to make the countercase.
                              If you don't like reality, change it! me
                              "Oh no! I am bested!" Drake
                              "it is dangerous to be right when the government is wrong" Voltaire
                              "Patriotism is a pernecious, psychopathic form of idiocy" George Bernard Shaw

                              Comment


                              • #90
                                [QUOTE] Originally posted by GePap

                                banning pre-election coolitions is a technical rule, and has nothing to do with "ending democracy", specially since one can have a democracy without a parlimentary system.



                                The ban on pre-election coalitions combines with the increased threshold to enter parliament, to reduce the extent of parliamentary opposition. Its a clever use of technical rules to gradually limit democracy (whether parliamentary or not, some legislative opposition is essential to a functioning democracy in the real world)

                                Jailing opposition candidates and an unfairt media are certainly undemocratic, but the fact is that even with an independent media in Russia (a country not known for the trust people give government, now is it?) Putin and his allies would still win. What does the opposition offer other than fear of more Putin rule? (Which a lot of Russians would approve off?)


                                So why does Putin bother with these things? Perhaps he smart enough to realize that he and his clique wont always be so popular (I saw an article saying that United Russia was polling at only about 60%, and thats with $100 oil pumping the Russian economy, and a still live memory of the economic collapse of 1998) and that NOW is the time to implement changes that will help him and them stay in power when his popularity wanes.
                                "A person cannot approach the divine by reaching beyond the human. To become human, is what this individual person, has been created for.” Martin Buber

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