Canadian aggressors tase immigrant to death

[LordShiva]

[LordShiva]

Airport Taser Death "Shocking, Disgusting"
NEW YORK, Nov. 16, 2007(CBS/AP) The first thing officers did when they got to a man in the Vancouver, Canada airport last month was taser him, even though we wasn't resisting them, according to a fellow traveler who videotaped the incident.

Shortly after being zapped, Robert Dziekanski, 40, died.

The video is causing international outrage, and the man who took it, fellow traveler Paul Pritchard, 25, of Victoria, British Columbia, spoke exclusively with The Early Show co-anchor Hannah Storm about the Oct. 14 incident Friday.

He called it "shocking" and "disgusting."

The video shows the man screaming and writhing in pain on the floor shortly before he dies.

Four Royal Canadian Mounted Police converged on Dziekanski, who couldn't speak English and who had languished in the airport arrivals area for 10 hours after his flight arrived. It was the first time he'd been on a plane.

Dziekanski had been waiting for his mother, who told him to wait in the baggage area. But she couldn't get in there, couldn't get a message to him, and finally went home after being told he never arrived.

On the video, a bystander tried to calm Dziekanski down, but he didn't understand. Then, he picked up a computer and threw it, then tossed a piece of furniture.

Dziekanski appeared calm when the police arrived.

The video shows him backing up, raising his hands and turning away before the police stun him with the 50,000-volt Taser, sending him to the floor screaming before he's stunned again and the Mounties pin down his head and limbs to handcuff him.

Pritchard told Storm it was the Mounties themselves who first made him realize the video, which they'd confiscated, might be worth retrieving, and publicizing.

He says he was motivated by "the fact that the police actually took it from me and didn't give it back, and, you know, broke a verbal agreement, promising to give it back, and they took it away. (That) led me to believe that maybe there's something important on that footage that I needed to get out to the public."

Pritchard says that, when the incident began, Dziekanski "was acting a little bit strange. He was banging on glass. He was actually trying to get back into the secured area.

"I woke up, and started watching. And as soon as he got back through the glass doors, that's when I started rolling with the film.

The Mounties took half-an-hour just to show up, Pritchard said, and "When police arrived, he stopped everything. He put up his hands. He gave up. When the police came, he thought it was over. The Mounties did not see him at this point break anything."

Why did they taser him?

"I have no idea," Pritchard responded. "It was the first step they took."

They tasered Dziekanski at least twice, Pritchard said, adding that after the first time, "There's audio of the man saying, 'Hit him again, hit him again' when he's on the ground.

"He was on the ground. There were three officers on him, then the officer says, 'Hit him again, hit him again.'

"One officer took his one knee and leg and kneeled on his neck and head. Unfortunately that's when he stopped -- he lost consciousness.

"He was screaming. He was shaking a bit. Then all of a sudden, his body went limp.

"It was shocking. It was disgusting."

A police timeline shows it took four minutes for the Mounties to call for medical assistance, and it was 12 minutes in all until help arrived.

"We didn't know what was going on," Pritchard recalled for Storm. "We were watching. And I stopped filming. We didn't know what to do. We heard someone say, 'Code red, and go call medics.' And you see someone check his pulse, but nobody gave him medical attention. But, as soon as the medics arrived, they ripped off his shirt, put in a mouthpiece, and right away started administering CPR."

When asked by Storm what he would say to Dziekanski's mother, he replied, "Apology, you know, as a Canadian -- we apologize. For everybody."

Pritchard says he believes his video recording will contribute to changes in police tactics in Canada when it comes to use of force.

The video has made its way around the world via the Internet and international newscasts, and prompted a flood of criticism of police.

Poland's ambassador to Canada, Piotr Ogrodzinski, says he was shocked by the video, adding it appears the police action was unsuitable and Poland wants some immediate answers.

RCMP Cpl. Dale Carr says he's been getting angry calls from people, but says they're coming to conclusions based on one piece of evidence and not waiting for all the evidence to come out. He says that won't happen until an inquest is held.

[Krill]

Originally posted by Wezil
Taser everybody. You never know if the person has had martial arts training and is a weapon.

It looks like that is the view the Canadian police are taking

[Wezil]

Let's not paint all cops with the same brush.

These were Mounties after all.

The RCMP has a legendary ability to screw up. The civilized provinces have replaced them with provincial police already.

[Krill]

[q=Wezil]The RCMP has a legendary ability to screw up. The civilized provinces have replaced them with provincial police already.[/q]

Which are...? Not BC or Alberta, I take it

[BeBMan]

Next time they better use a Tehser. /silly

[Kidlicious]

Originally posted by Donegeal


Then you're just skimming. The Tazer is NOT my first option. 99 times out of 100 I get voluntary compliance by just talking with the guy. Sometimes I have to draw the Tazer to get them to comply. Sometimes (if there is time) a spark test does the trick. Only rarely do I actually fire the thing (and although most of you guys refuse to believe it, its the same for almost all cops).

Applying electric shock to someone to get the to comply is torture and nothing but. Truly avoiding serious injury is acceptable to many, but that not the case many times. We've all seen how it's not.

[Kidlicious]

Originally posted by Donegeal
Yes, I said I was very inclined to use it in a specific situation. A possibly armed resistive subject. How is that monsterous?

Because the only options you see are inflicting pain and/or injury to people. What's wrong with a little patience and diplomacy.

[Donegeal]

What do you think I do Kid? Sit there and go "Aw, come on, please? It'll make everything so much easier.". No, if time is available, I explain to them exactly what's going to happen with each choice they make.

By the time I get to the point where I have to subdue them with a Tazer, I can pretty well document that they did everything but actually ask to get tazed.

[Wezil]

That approach assumes the person you are interacting with is "rational".

Scenario - You and 3 other officers want to apprehend someone that is unarmed but not complying with your requests. Do you physically "take him down" or would you use a Taser?

[Wezil]

Originally posted by Krill
[q=Wezil]The RCMP has a legendary ability to screw up. The civilized provinces have replaced them with provincial police already.[/q]

Which are...? Not BC or Alberta, I take it

Ontario, Quebec and I believe Manitoba.

One of the problems with the RCMP is too wide a mandate. They perform chores ranging from national security to writing seatbelt tickets.

Just imagine the FBI pulling people over in Utah and issuing speeding tickets...

[Donegeal]

Originally posted by Wezil
That approach assumes the person you are interacting with is "rational".

Scenario - You and 3 other officers want to apprehend someone that is unarmed but not complying with your requests. Do you physically "take him down" or would you use a Taser?

You're right. maybe I should just starting making the worst case scenerio all the time and assume that the people are always irrational. It's probably closer to reality.

By the way, in your scenerio, it would depend greatly on the manor of the resistiveness (and which officer was in charge).

Is he just standing their limp or is he showing signs of aggressive ness (ie: thousand mile stare, clenched fists, hightened tension, is he looking at strike points? There are a number of things to look for).

[Kidlicious]

Originally posted by Donegeal
What do you think I do Kid? Sit there and go "Aw, come on, please? It'll make everything so much easier.". No, if time is available, I explain to them exactly what's going to happen with each choice they make.

By the time I get to the point where I have to subdue them with a Tazer, I can pretty well document that they did everything but actually ask to get tazed.

Taser was only supposed to be used in place of deadly force. Why don't you do that?

[Wezil]

Donageal -

I wasn't trying to be sarcastic (for a change). Just pointing out that you can try to reason with some people all day and it will get you nowhere. It won't always work as you know. Drugs, mental illness, emotional distress, etc...

The point I have been getting at is that policing involves risk and sometimes I expect officers to use good old fashioned force to subdue someone. Particularly with superior numbers and an unarmed suspect. I feel the thinking by officers is shifting to one of talk first (usually anyways) and if they don't comply taser them. I want something more than talking and less than tasering.

[Donegeal]

Originally posted by Kidicious


Taser was only supposed to be used in place of deadly force. Why don't you do that?

Dynamite was orginally made to help in construction. What's your point?