Hillary's Healthcare Plan

[PLATO]

Originally posted by Imran Siddiqui

It sure sounds like private health care is finding a way to pay the costs through the setting of premiums. Why should the government get involved?

The government is involved. Everyone that goes to an emergency room has to be treated! Regardless of ability to pay.

So we already have universal health care.

Now why do we want the government to control another $110 billion of our money?

It is all about control folks. If you really want Big Brother....

[aneeshm]

Re: Re: Hillary's Healthcare Plan

Originally posted by Imran Siddiqui


IIRC, part of the plan is that insurance companies are mandated to offer some minimal form of insurance to everyone.

Won't that mean that prices for everyone else go up?

[lord of the mark]

[QUOTE] Originally posted by Ramo

I'm skeptical about mandates until we know that the program is keeping costs down and subsidies high enough (MA had to revise its subsidy).

So you, like Cali, dont understand the moral hazard issue? Sorry, thats harsh, but I thought wed been over this.

But it looks like a decent enough plan, very similar to Edwards'. Better than I expected.

The key to all three plans is that they include a public health insurance component, and therefore a path to single payer.

Im not sure thats the most crucial aspect.

I could live with any of the three plans. They're much better than Richardson's univeral health care without rolling back the Bush tax cuts or Giuliani's universal health care by a fixed tax deduction independent of income.

The question, though, becomes which of the three are most willing to fight for the important parts of the plan (i.e. a public health insurance). Needless to say, I'm the most skeptical of Clinton's committment.

And needless to say, I see no basis for that.

[lord of the mark]

Re: Re: Re: Hillary's Healthcare Plan

Originally posted by aneeshm


Won't that mean that prices for everyone else go up?

Depends - see discussions of emergency rooms, of subsidies for folks to buy insurance, etc. This has a lot of moving parts.

[PLATO]

Re: Re: Re: Hillary's Healthcare Plan

Originally posted by aneeshm


Won't that mean that prices for everyone else go up?

Taxes my man. Where do you think they will get the $110 billion?

And that is just the "projected amount". Once Uncle Sam gets ahold of it, then it will soon make social security look like a minor expenditure. The dems will, of course, claim that the rich should bear the burden for the good of society. Soon, the redistribution of income will be complete. Then, guess what? No more venture capital and the US becomes a second rate country. But you can get a free flu shot!

[PLATO]

Re: Re: Re: Re: Hillary's Healthcare Plan

Originally posted by lord of the mark


Depends - see discussions of emergency rooms, of subsidies for folks to buy insurance, etc. This has a lot of moving parts.

Of course, this totally discounts the vast increase of medical facility usage and the overwhelming costs of government beauracracy

[aneeshm]

Re: Re: Re: Re: Hillary's Healthcare Plan

Originally posted by PLATO

Taxes my man. Where do you think they will get the $110 billion?

Wait a minute. You're telling me that the US is going to spend a further $110,000,000,000 on this scheme? Don't you already have cash problems? Where will this money come from?

It's not possible to treat the market economy as some sort of source of infinite wealth - it just doesn't work that way. You usually end up making things worse than they were before, by screwing up something you didn't know would be affected in the way it was. It's like trying to perform brain surgery with a hammer and sickle.

Originally posted by PLATO

And that is just the "projected amount". Once Uncle Sam gets ahold of it, then it will soon make social security look like a minor expenditure.

Who did the financial analysis? Was it a proper bunch of impartial economists, or was it semi-partial bureaucrats, or was it a set of completely biased party hacks? A lot depends on who projected this figure.

[Aeson]

So...

I have no health insurance, and very little money. What happens to me? I have to buy health insurance?

[aneeshm]

When it comes to the upcoming US election, my support for Ron Paul grows with every statement made by everyone else.

[Imran Siddiqui]

Originally posted by PLATO
So we already have universal health care.

Now why do we want the government to control another $110 billion of our money?

It is all about control folks. If you really want Big Brother....

Because it's done horribly at the moment? A lot of poor folks don't have insurance coverage and the US spends more per capita on health care than any other industrialized country. So they can't preventative care and can only get health care when something of an "emergency" happens to them.

And yes, it is about control. I'd rather have the government regulating the insurance industry tightly than giving them a relative free hand. I trust the government more than the insurance industry (I don't know anyone that actually does trust the insurance industry, actually).

[Aeson]

I trust the insurance industry to screw me over however it can.

[Aeson]

I should add that I also trust the government to screw me over however it can... just that I also trust they are significantly more incompetent at doing so.

[PLATO]

Originally posted by Imran Siddiqui


Because it's done horribly at the moment? A lot of poor folks don't have insurance coverage and the US spends more per capita on health care than any other industrialized country.

And yes, it is about control. I'd rather have the government regulating the insurance industry tightly than giving them a relative free hand. I trust the government more than the insurance industry (I don't know anyone that actually does trust the insurance industry, actually).

Regulation is far different from government control.

The US spend more per capita because we have the best facilities in the world. All brought to you by private enterprise.

I am interested on what any Canadians and British might have to say about government health care. ????

[aneeshm]

Originally posted by Imran Siddiqui


Because it's done horribly at the moment? A lot of poor folks don't have insurance coverage and the US spends more per capita on health care than any other industrialized country.

And yes, it is about control. I'd rather have the government regulating the insurance industry tightly than giving them a relative free hand. I trust the government more than the insurance industry (I don't know anyone that actually does trust the insurance industry, actually).

"Underlying most opposition to the free market is a lack of belief in freedom itself."

Imran, most economists who support the free market do so precisely because they do not trust the individual agents that constitute it.

[PLATO]

Originally posted by Aeson
I should add that I also trust the government to screw me over however it can... just that I also trust they are significantly more incompetent at doing so.

Hahahaha


"I am from the government...I am here to help"

Love your country...fear your governmrnt.