Why is France the new hawk in Europe?

[Lancer]

So is France stepping up to lead a coalition of sanction supporting states? What concrete steps have they taken? What exactly did they do to deserve their 'hawk' status?

[Shrapnel12]

We thought the youth of Iran was going to rise up once before and it didn't happen. In fact, aren't they even more fanatical then their elders now? Also, I believe Iran is a democracy as much as I believe Egypt and Pakistan are.

BTW, in honor of France's new "hawkishness", I shall lay off the French jokes for a while. Gotta give credit where credit is due even where it's least expected.

[Lancer]

Shrapnel. First I want to find out if its all smoke and no fire.

[lord of the mark]

Originally posted by Lancer
So is France stepping up to lead a coalition of sanction supporting states? What concrete steps have they taken? What exactly did they do to deserve their 'hawk' status?

Nothing really. Kouchner said, War is the worst, and we should be prepared for the worst. Hardly the ringing call to battle some folks are making it out to be.

They ARE supporting tougher sanctions at the UNSC, but theyve been doing that for awhile. And they are now supporting the possibility of EU sanctions if Russia and China block UN sanctions.

[Lancer]

That's what I expected.

[lord of the mark]

Originally posted by Shrapnel12
We thought the youth of Iran was going to rise up once before and it didn't happen. In fact, aren't they even more fanatical then their elders now? Also, I believe Iran is a democracy as much as I believe Egypt and Pakistan are.

the number who will rise up purely over issues of democracy turns out to small enough the regime can successfully clamp down on them. Im not under the impression many are fanatics though. When the economic situation gets bad, they will do what people have done in so many places.

Thats why the Iranian regime spends so much time claiming the West is trying to deny them, not nuclear weapons, but nuclear energy. On that basis they can blame any sanctions on teh evil West preventing economic development. Thats why its essential we assert Irans right to nuclear power, but NOT uranium enrichment.

As for Pakistan, you might want to watch events there more closely.

I dont think either the govts of Pakistan or Egypt could survive a sustained campaigns either.

Note of course I never said Iran is a democracy, I said its authoritarian. In contrast to Iraq, which was totalitarian.

Where is Jean Kirkpatrick now that we need her?

[Cort Haus]

Originally posted by lord of the mark
Nothing really. Kouchner said, War is the worst, and we should be prepared for the worst. Hardly the ringing call to battle some folks are making it out to be.

http://afp.google.com/article/ALeqM5h2E4FueHFgmM1GImXHiG4vnRc-lQ

Kouchner warned, "We have to prepare for the worst, and the worst is war."

Kouchner is surely saying "prepare for war". However, like Blair, it will not be he and his country that will lead the way, but the USA. Ultimately, policy responsibility lies with Washington. Like Blair, he seeks the glow of a sense of mission and purpose as he struts the world stage, knowing full well that it won't be his country that will be doing the heavy lifting.

[Lancer]

The EU can handle Iran, they don't need the US. They just need a set of balls and maybe now they've got one. Lets see if the population has the will for it.

[Cort Haus]

What kind of war scenario with Iran are people after here? Something like Iraq, except bigger?

[Lancer]

...and with France leading the way and the US sitting on the sidelines being critical, yes.

[Cort Haus]

You just want Yoorp be stuck in the same SNAFU that the US is in with Iraq, don't you?

You're jealous.

[Lancer]

Actually I think we, the 'West', united, should tell the Iranians that they have one week to open up their nuke program for us to remove, dismantle all terrorist groups on their territory, detain the terrorists and hand them over, stop dissing the US in the media and from the pulpit and make a blanket statement disavowing the jihad or face carpet bombing of their cities, starting with Tehran, to commence in one weeks time. Then, drop leaflets on Tehran telling everyone they have one week to get out of town.

Put it on them to decide if they should have cities or not. One after another, warn them, give the people a week, then destroy the city. Conventional dumb bombs.

That ought to do it.

The terrorists give the folks in the WTC a week?

[Lancer]

The rocket attacks on Israel would be better examples of Iranian terrorism. They don't give notice to the citizens of the towns they target. That crap has got to stop and Iran is behind much of it.

I commend the French for speaking up, but unless they follow their words with something real nobody will listen to them in the future. This has become the norm in western diplomacy too. The UN made how many resolutions against Iraq? So many Saddam didn't have to buy toilet paper any more.

[Cort Haus]

Originally posted by Lancer
The terrorists give the folks in the WTC a week?

What's the prescription for Saudi-Arabia then?

[Lancer]

That's the really tough one. I don't know.