What was the greatest MBT?

[Patroklos]

Who still uses it?

The Sherman had a very long shelf life as well.

[Alexander's Horse]

third world countries - the T34/85

[Proteus_MST]

I hope for them that they only use it for training purposes.

Using it in the regular fighting force sounds like a foolish thing to do as I doubt that any MBT from WW 2, even if used in great numbers would be a match for MBTs of the 80s or even more modern tanks.

[GePap]

Except that the foes those T34/85 are being used against are mainly rebels and groups without any sort of armor vehicles, and probably not too well equiped with modern RPG's either.

[Dr Strangelove]

I thought that RPG-7s were almost as ubiquitous in the third world as AK-47s?

[Alexander's Horse]

both copies of German weapons

[DanS]

Originally posted by Patroklos
we are not ranking the efficiency nation's industry.

It would be valid to include a consideration of ease of manufacture, however.

[Patroklos]

It would be valid to include a consideration of ease of manufacture, however.

I agree depending on what we are comparing, especially since ease of maintenance in the field usually follows ease of manufacture.

However, when two tanks of different varieties meet head to head on an isolated patch of Russian steepe, the fact that you have 10,000 tanks somewhere else is not much comfort.

I would be curious what you guys think of overlapping road wheels. Are the benifits worth the costs? Beter weight distribution over the tracks but they wear the tracks out faster and have a tendancy to freeze in the winter if mud/water is left on them overnight.

[Alexander's Horse]

if you include economics its t34 or sherman

[Patroklos]

I don't know, there are other tanks that would have had just as many units if they were being built by the industial might of America or Russia vice Britain, Germany, or France.

Just as German crews in Shermans most likely would have cleaned the floor with against American crews in Panthers (Russian front PzIV vs. T34s prove this). You have to assume all else being equal, and look at the tank itself.

[Alexander's Horse]

on success you'd have to include Panver III and IV

[Patroklos]

I don't know about the PzIII, as its armor was ridiculously thin compared with its opponents, especially in Russia. Coupled with an ineffective main gun and it is amazing it faired as well as it did.

[Alexander's Horse]

yeah but you have to compare like with like, it was a world beater 1939 to 41 and still competitive in 42

Things like speed and reliability come into play

and a true medium tank

[Proteus_MST]

Especially since, like the Pz IV, it was constantly upgraded
and got better armor as well as better armament during the years of war.

[Patroklos]

yeah but you have to compare like with like, it was a world beater 1939 to 41 and still competitive in 42

Especially since, like the Pz IV, it was constantly upgraded

Eh, one on one, better German tactics asside, it was hoplessly outclassed by the Char B and Matilda in 40, and it never equaled a T-34/76 even in its most advanced forms as the Germans themselves recognized (this can actually be said about the PzIV too).