Sealion, Anglo-German Alliance

[lord of the mark]

Originally posted by Cort Haus

Though, I have heard claims that there may have been a (gasp) imported ME element to the ancient Britons. The Saxons, it is claimed, pushed the Britons west into Wales, and many Welsh are dark-haired, dark-eyed and even relatively dark-skinned, compared to the pale redheads and blonds associated with the Celts.

Britons as Lost Tribes of Israel, or a group of Trojans who didnt stick Aeneis, are the two popular legends, I think.

[Wycoff]

Originally posted by Cort Haus Though, I have heard claims that there may have been a (gasp) imported ME element to the ancient Britons. The Saxons, it is claimed, pushed the Britons west into Wales, and many Welsh are dark-haired, dark-eyed and even relatively dark-skinned, compared to the pale redheads and blonds associated with the Celts.

That ME component probably wouldn't have bothered the Nazis that much if they ultimately considered Welsh to be Aryans. Remember, Iranians and Northern Indians were considered Aryans, and they were much darker than Poles and other Slavs.

I don't know how the Celts fit into Nazi ideology. IIRC, they were in the weird limbo that included Latins, Balts, and Hungarians- they weren't Aryan, but they weren't üntermenschen.

[BeBMan]

Originally posted by Ecthy
In the views of Hitler the people of Great Britain weren't much different from Germans. keep in mind that NS racial ideology was not based on ethnological or linguistic science as we know it today. It was pure mythical bull**** and built more around measuring heads and faces and evaluating dominant/submissive behaviour than actual comparison on a linguistical or cultural basis.

Yeah, Hitler's racist views esp. in MK are hardly more than unqualified rants.

[Barnabas]

If I recall correctly, in Hitlers time, the main theory was the the original indoeuropean/aryans/ were from north germany and scandinavia, now it seems they were nomads from the ukraine and russia and kazakhstan, who invaded or migrated into europe, the caucasus, iran and india.

I always think, both Stalin and Hitler killed millions, but Stalin was more tolerable (that it is better that he won the war), because, altough paranoid, he did not believe in all the racial mystic esoteric bull**** nazis believed.

[Ecthy]

So killing someone is worse if you kill him for ethnic beliefs than if you kill him out of calculus?

[Barnabas]

What I mean is stalin is no different than any great conqueror and pragmatic killer of millions like G Khan or the guy who unified China from antiquity or the history of mankind, while Hitler was something else, completely new, because of his racial ideology.
In comparison the crazyest things commies gave us was marxism materialsm applied to everything, history, linguistics etc, with Hitler anthropologists would still be measuring the skulls of poor dark people.

Now that I think of it better, had Hiter won, more people would have died probably, since he wanted to exterminate poles and ukrainians to repopulate the land with germans, germanising those lands, and who knows what would have happened in the rest of the world.The loss of germany had the immediate consequence of removing from the mainstream many racial beliefs.

[BeBMan]

I think if we look at the dimensions here one can hardly say "more" or "less tolerable".

[lord of the mark]

Originally posted by Barnabas
I always think, both Stalin and Hitler killed millions, but Stalin was more tolerable (that it is better that he won the war), because, altough paranoid, he did not believe in all the racial mystic esoteric bull**** nazis believed.

OK, forget about any discussion of sealion etc on THIS thread.

[Barnabas]

What I mean is a victorious nazi germany would have had a much more negative impact of mankind than the one the soviet union had, ad if I had to choose to fight in the red army of the ss, I would choose the red army.

edit: lost post on this by me since we are threadjacking.

[BeBMan]

Oh, and technically there is really not much difference between exclusion (followed by persecution and extermination) based on race or exclusion (followed by persecution and extermination) based on other reasons like class or even exclusion (followed by persecution and extermination) based on pure paranoia.

[Ecthy]

Edit: pointless remark

LOTM has a point.

A potential Britain - Germany alliance could not come to be for reasons strategic, ideological and principal.

[Cort Haus]

Other than that pananoia is an individual problem rather than a deeply ideological one, held by the whole party and its supporters.

[BeBMan]

Sigh, ok back on track

I agree, though Hitler may have hoped for something else, given that he thought he saves the world when attacking Bolshevism.

edit re paranoia - it can be more than just a personal prob if it's about a certain mindset as a result from certain conditions.

[Zkribbler]

Originally posted by Barnabas
I always think, both Stalin and Hitler killed millions, but Stalin was more tolerable (that it is better that he won the war), because, altough paranoid, he did not believe in all the racial mystic esoteric bull**** nazis believed.

Right, although Hitler was prejudiced, Stalin wasn't. He killed everyone.

[Cort Haus]

Am I right in recalling that at the start of the cold war Churchill said "we killed the wrong pig"? If I am also right in recalling that Churchill made reference to "Jewish Bolshevism"?

If so, maybe Hitler's wet dream was not so much of a fantasy. It might be that the only thing Churchill really cared about was his beloved Empire, which he didn't think was safe with a powerful Germany.