Mexican Oil field to go under?

[DanS]

Much of this seems to be government-sector negligence. The oil majors look angelic in comparison. Water/oil separators are amazingly simple devices. The article makes it sound like these types of things are super magic high tech devices or something.

As for the field itself, it's really amazing that it has lasted this long. There are other fields being discovered, but in less hospitable areas than shallow waters in Mexico. Those areas are where the high tech comes into play. Jack Field off of Louisiana requires engineering that is downright impressive.

[Lawrence of Arabia]

Indeed. He also argues that low interest rates are bad because they lead to more development, and other absurd things.

what are you, retarted? i argue that too much capital can lead to difficulties in assessing which projects are more more likely to succeed/ are most useful because it creates artifically lower interest rates. when money is cheap, people (especially the government) invests it in the wrong places because they either a) believe that there will be more coming/ there is lots of it, so a failure now doesnt mean much or b) believe that since rates are low, all projects are profitable/ useful.

poor investment decisions eventually fail, leading to a) a loss of capital that could have been invested elswhere and b) all sorts of macroeconomic problems (in the most general form, there is an increase in the standard deviation of gdp growth) or result in a loss, which is the same as a).

[notyoueither]

Originally posted by Lawrence of Arabia

Indeed. He also argues that low interest rates are bad because they lead to more development, and other absurd things.

what are you, retarted?

No, but you seem to be the mental giant who is making blanket statements like this gem:

countries rich in natural resources have problems because there is a lot of incentive to steal, rebel, kill, to get the huge revenues linked to these resources

Are you describing Canada, the United States, or Mexico?

Are you describing economics, social systems, or a feeling you have in your ass? Do you have a clue that there is a difference?

[Dinner]

Originally posted by DanS
Much of this seems to be government-sector negligence. The oil majors look angelic in comparison. Water/oil separators are amazingly simple devices. The article makes it sound like these types of things are super magic high tech devices or something.

QFT. You can make one with concrete or if you just use a settling tower the oil will float up and the water will sink. Stopping production on wells which are still 90% oil and 10% water is stupid and just means the company/government doesn't want to spend the money building a few cheap oil-water separators. If they're not willing to do something so cheap then that's a sure sign of under investment in the state run oil sector. With old but slightly more expensive technology like steam inject, which was started in use in the late 60's, you can get a huge amount of life out of old fields.

[Dinner]

Originally posted by Lawrence of Arabia

Indeed. He also argues that low interest rates are bad because they lead to more development, and other absurd things.

what are you, retarted? i argue that too much capital can lead to difficulties in assessing which projects are more more likely to succeed/ are most useful because it creates artifically lower interest rates. when money is cheap, people (especially the government) invests it in the wrong places because they either a) believe that there will be more coming/ there is lots of it, so a failure now doesnt mean much or b) believe that since rates are low, all projects are profitable/ useful.

poor investment decisions eventually fail, leading to a) a loss of capital that could have been invested elswhere and b) all sorts of macroeconomic problems (in the most general form, there is an increase in the standard deviation of gdp growth) or result in a loss, which is the same as a).

LoA is right about this. It has been called the "oil disease" because it leads to lots of low return capital investment, usually by state owned monopolies, which sucks up all available capital starving other more profitable investments for funds. A good way to fight the oil disease is to privatize so that overly exuberant government officials can't sink a nation's entire wealth into their pet projects. When private companies are forced to put their own money on the line they do a better job of judging risk to reward; at least in most cases.

[notyoueither]

The question isn't about oil or no oil.

The question is how to organise society and what role governments should play, and a lot more than that in the social sphere.

The question goes way beyond being resource rich or poor. Mexico's problems have near zero to do with having oil. They would have similar problems with or without it.

[Barnabas]

The issue is if no longer exporting oil and having to even import it would screw up Mexico´s economy.

Lawrence thinks it would be even good for Mexico, I think it would be very bad.

[DanS]

Originally posted by notyoueither
The question isn't about oil or no oil.

The question is how to organise society and what role governments should play, and a lot more than that in the social sphere.

The question goes way beyond being resource rich or poor. Mexico's problems have near zero to do with having oil. They would have similar problems with or without it.

Oil is potentially negative in the sense that it sometimes disassociates government services from the dictates of the voting taxpayers. This interplay is the bedrock of democracy.

[KrazyHorse]

Originally posted by Lawrence of Arabia

Aparently he doesn't realise that if you have a machine which puts out more money than it takes in you are able to use the excess to pay for that other **** he wants.

its one thing to have the moneey to do it, its another to do it. having the money and not doing it is the same as not having the money and not doing it.

Human Development Index (top 15 oil export countries bolded, non democratic countries with **)

#1 Norway: 0.963
#2 Iceland: 0.956
#3 Australia: 0.955
#4 Luxembourg: 0.949
#5 Canada: 0.949
#6 Sweden: 0.949
#7 Switzerland: 0.947
#8 Ireland: 0.946
#9 Belgium: 0.945
#10 United States: 0.944
#11 Netherlands: 0.943
#12 Japan: 0.943
#13 Finland: 0.941
#14 Denmark: 0.941
#15 United Kingdom: 0.939
#16 France: 0.938
#17 Austria: 0.936
#18 Italy: 0.934
#19 New Zealand: 0.933
#20 Germany: 0.93
#21 Spain: 0.928
#22 Hong Kong: 0.916
#23 Israel: 0.915
#24 Greece: 0.912
#25 Singapore: 0.907
#26 Slovenia: 0.904
#27 Portugal: 0.904
#28 Korea, South: 0.901
#29 Cyprus: 0.891
#30 Barbados: 0.878
#31 Czech Republic: 0.874
#32 Malta: 0.867
#33 Brunei: 0.866
#34 Argentina: 0.863
#35 Hungary: 0.862
#36 Poland: 0.858
#37 Chile: 0.854
#38 Estonia: 0.853
#39 Lithuania: 0.852
#40 Qatar: 0.849 **
#41 United Arab Emirates: 0.849 **
#42 Slovakia: 0.849
#43 Bahrain: 0.846
#44 Kuwait: 0.844 **
#45 Croatia: 0.841
#46 Uruguay: 0.84
#47 Costa Rica: 0.838
#48 Latvia: 0.836
#49 Saint Kitts and Nevis: 0.834
#50 Bahamas, The: 0.832
#51 Seychelles: 0.821
#52 Cuba: 0.817
#53 Mexico: 0.814
#54 Tonga: 0.81
#55 Bulgaria: 0.808
#56 Panama: 0.804
#57 Trinidad and Tobago: 0.801
#58 Libya: 0.799 **
#59 Antigua and Barbuda: 0.797
#60 Macedonia, Republic of: 0.797
#61 Malaysia: 0.796
#62 Russia: 0.795
#63 Brazil: 0.792
#64 Romania: 0.792
#65 Mauritius: 0.791
#66 Grenada: 0.787
#67 Belarus: 0.786
#68 Bosnia and Herzegovina: 0.786
#69 Colombia: 0.785
#70 Dominica: 0.783
#71 Oman: 0.781
#72 Albania: 0.78
#73 Thailand: 0.778
#74 Samoa: 0.776
#75 Saudi Arabia: 0.772 **
#76 Venezuela: 0.772 **
#77 Saint Lucia: 0.772
#78 Ukraine: 0.766
#79 Peru: 0.762
#80 Kazakhstan: 0.761
#81 Lebanon: 0.759
#82 Ecuador: 0.759
#83 Armenia: 0.759
#84 Philippines: 0.758
#85 Suriname: 0.755
#86 Paraguay: 0.755
#87 Saint Vincent and the Grenadines: 0.755
#88 China: 0.755
#89 Belize: 0.753
#90 Jordan: 0.753
#91 Tunisia: 0.753
#92 Fiji: 0.752
#93 Sri Lanka: 0.751
#94 Turkey: 0.75
#95 Dominican Republic: 0.749
#96 Maldives: 0.745
#97 Jamaica: 0.738
#98 Turkmenistan: 0.738
#99 Iran: 0.736 **
#100 Georgia: 0.732
#101 Azerbaijan: 0.729
#102 West Bank: 0.729
#103 Gaza Strip: 0.729
#104 Algeria: 0.722 **
#105 El Salvador: 0.722
#106 Cape Verde: 0.721
#107 Syria: 0.721
#108 Guyana: 0.72
#109 Vietnam: 0.704
#110 Kyrgyzstan: 0.702
#111 Indonesia: 0.697
#112 Uzbekistan: 0.694
#113 Nicaragua: 0.69
#114 Bolivia: 0.687
#115 Mongolia: 0.679
#116 Moldova: 0.671
#117 Honduras: 0.667
#118 Guatemala: 0.663
#119 Vanuatu: 0.659
#120 Egypt: 0.659
#121 South Africa: 0.658
#122 Equatorial Guinea: 0.655
#123 Tajikistan: 0.652
#124 Gabon: 0.635
#125 Morocco: 0.631
#126 Namibia: 0.627
#127 São Tomé and PrÃncipe: 0.604
#128 India: 0.602
#129 Solomon Islands: 0.594
#130 Burma: 0.578
#131 Cambodia: 0.571
#132 Botswana: 0.565
#133 Comoros: 0.547
#134 Laos: 0.545
#135 Bhutan: 0.536
#136 Pakistan: 0.527
#137 Nepal: 0.526
#138 Papua New Guinea: 0.523
#139 Ghana: 0.52
#140 Bangladesh: 0.52
#141 East Timor: 0.513
#142 Togo: 0.512
#143 Sudan: 0.512
#144 Congo, Republic of the: 0.512
#145 Uganda: 0.508
#146 Zimbabwe: 0.505
#147 Madagascar: 0.499
#148 Swaziland: 0.498
#149 Cameroon: 0.497
#150 Lesotho: 0.497
#151 Djibouti: 0.495
#152 Yemen: 0.489
#153 Mauritania: 0.477
#154 Haiti: 0.475
#155 Kenya: 0.474
#156 Gambia, The: 0.47
#157 Guinea: 0.466
#158 Senegal: 0.458
#159 Nigeria: 0.453
#160 Rwanda: 0.45
#161 Angola: 0.445
#162 Eritrea: 0.444
#163 Benin: 0.431
#164 Côte d'Ivoire: 0.42
#165 Tanzania: 0.418
#166 Malawi: 0.404
#167 Zambia: 0.394
#168 Congo, Democratic Republic of the: 0.385
#169 Mozambique: 0.379
#170 Burundi: 0.378
#171 Ethiopia: 0.367
#172 Central African Republic: 0.355
#173 Guinea-Bissau: 0.348
#174 Chad: 0.341
#175 Mali: 0.333
#176 Burkina Faso: 0.317
#177 Sierra Leone: 0.298
#178 Niger: 0.281
weighted average = 0.7

What's great about this listing is that it demonstrates that oil exporting countries tend to have higher HDIs than their non-oil exporting neighbours with similar histories.

[Geronimo]

Originally posted by KrazyHorse


What's great about this listing is that it demonstrates that oil exporting countries tend to have higher HDIs than their non-oil exporting neighbours with similar histories.

Are you being ironic? I can think of vastly better ways to display that relationship than with this list. I can't see how you think it does a great job of demonstrating that oil exporting countries tend to have higher HDIs than their non-oil exporting peers.

[KrazyHorse]

Originally posted by Geronimo


Are you being ironic? I can think of vastly better ways to display that relationship than with this list. I can't see how you think it does a great job of demonstrating that oil exporting countries tend to have higher HDIs than their non-oil exporting peers.

Are you incapable of reading? I never said that the list was the best way to demonstrate that relationship, or even that it was a great way to demonstrate that relationship.

I said that the list was "great" (and particularly that it was great in the context of LoA posting it in order to prove the opposite) because it does demonstrate it.

Norway tops out the Nordic countries. Canada beats out the US. The Arab and North African countries with oil are higher than those without oil. Kazakhstan beats the other central Asian "stans"

Mexico, Nigeria and Angola are pretty near the middle of the pack (as far as their peers are concerned) and Russia is simply peerless (in that it is completely unique, and comparisons to surrounding countries are bound to be more suspect than usual).

[Geronimo]

Originally posted by KrazyHorse


Are you incapable of reading? I never said that the list was the best way to demonstrate that relationship, or even that it was a great way to demonstrate that relationship.

I said that the list was "great" (and particularly that it was great in the context of LoA posting it in order to prove the opposite) because it does demonstrate it.

Norway tops out the Nordic countries. Canada beats out the US. The Arab and North African countries with oil are higher than those without oil. Kazakhstan beats the other central Asian "stans"

Mexico, Nigeria and Angola are pretty near the middle of the pack (as far as their peers are concerned) and Russia is simply peerless (in that it is completely unique, and comparisons to surrounding countries are bound to be more suspect than usual).

Misreading the manner in which you meant "great" hardly constitutes evidence of poor reading comprehension.

I still think a map would have been much preferable as a way of displaying the information regardless of how your earlier post might be interpreted.

[notyoueither]

Originally posted by DanS

Oil is potentially negative in the sense that it sometimes disassociates government services from the dictates of the voting taxpayers.

Sure. That's a much better way of putting it. I can tell you first hand that a government awash in funds can get away with a lot that doesn't have to pass the test of a tax increase.

This interplay is the bedrock of democracy.

Yes, but...

The countries LoA thinks would be better off without oil were never renowned for responsible, democratic government.

Just the reverse, I would say that increasing wealth and education levels that can come from it might do more for an evolution of democracy and economic development in many countries than another 400 years of poverty with little money to invest in human capital.

[Hauldren Collider]

[The Mad Monk]

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