The United States's singular nature

[Wernazuma III]

This is a language thread.

I'm asking because I know that "the United States" has to be treated as singular: "The United States has" and not "...have".
But that means as a consequence that I'd have to write "The United States's efforts" - and this hurts.
So, is it correct?

On another note: do you think "join together" is a good expression?
I think "together" is completely redundant since you can't "join apart".

Opinions please.

[BeBMan]

Wouldn't "The United States' (so without another "s") efforts" do it? Also, if you're unsure, can't you simply change the sentence to a form you're sure about?

[Provost Harrison]

Don't worry, a native English speaker has arrived...

...erm, not the foggiest BeBro's sounds right though

[Stuie]

"The efforts of the United States..."

[SlowwHand]

Thank you nad congrats, Stuie. Harrison, um um um. You get a Viking smiley.
Worthless for worthless.

[Cort Haus]

"join together" is ok, I think, as an expression. There may be some redundancy but unless you are paying by the letter I don't see a problem.

Interestingly US English and British English do treat some nouns differently - like band names are treated as plural here but singular in the US. So in the US : "Led Zeppelin was a rock band" but in the UK "Led Zeppelin were a rock band".

[Ogie Oglethorpe]

The Who "Join Together with the band"

[Kidlicious]

Several politicians us "join together," and I'm not just talking about Bush.

[Wernazuma III]

Originally posted by BeBro
Wouldn't "The United States' (so without another "s") efforts" do it?

As I understand it, in singular, the second "'s" is required although it's often omited in practice. I may be wrong though, that's why I need a native speaker with grammar knowledge to clear things up.

Also, if you're unsure, can't you simply change the sentence to a form you're sure about?

It's not MY text.


Thanks, Cort Haus, for clarifying the join together bit.

[Kidlicious]

Originally posted by Wernazuma III

As I understand it, in singular, the second "'s" is required although it's often omited in practice. I may be wrong though, that's why I need a native speaker with grammar knowledge to clear things up.

I'm pretty sure you don't use the second "s." It's the United States' effort.

[Wycoff]

Originally posted by Wernazuma III

As I understand it, in singular, the second "'s" is required although it's often omited in practice. I may be wrong though, that's why I need a native speaker with grammar knowledge to clear things up.

In English, the 's is added in two situations. It is mandatory when the noun ends in any letter other than s.

For example: the lion's den.

The other time that it can be used is in connection with someone's name: Charles's car.

However, "Charles' car" is also proper.

If the noun is not a name but ends with an s, then you leave off the s.:

For example: the birds' nest.

You can use either United States's or United States'
I prefer the version without the s.

[Kidlicious]

Spell checker doesn't like United States's and I've never seen it like that. I could be wrong though.

[Wycoff]

Originally posted by Kidicious
Spell checker doesn't like United States's and I've never seen it like that. I could be wrong though.

I think that this is part of the language that is currently in flux. When I was in elementary school, I was taught that you never added the s when the word ended with an s, even if the noun was someone's name. However, that has changed. Charles's is acceptable usage now. I think that United States's would also be acceptable.

The thing that drives me crazy today is the usage of an apostrophe to show plurality. For example, people are starting to write "We have ten dog's" rather than "We have ten dogs."

[lord of the mark]

BTW, prior to the Amer Civil War, it was customary to say "The United States have" IE to treat it as a plural. After the Civil War, the usage as a singular became standard.

[Kidlicious]

Originally posted by Wycoff
Charles's is acceptable usage now. I think that United States's would also be acceptable.

Yeah, Charles's is ok because of phonetics I think, but not United States's.

The thing that drives me crazy today is the usage of an apostrophe to show plurality. For example, people are starting to write "We have ten dog's" rather than "We have ten dogs."

I didn't know that. That is disturbing.