I am tired of war

[SlowwHand]

I want you to not that in the beginnings posts of this thread it's been said that USA wants to conqueor the world and are thought to be isolationist.

Well, alll of you can kiss my ass. There's no making all happy, so my vote goes to your happiness doesn't count. How do you like that?

[Lorizael]

From one American to another, Sloww, please stop drinking.

[SlowwHand]

You mean start?

[Jon Miller]

Originally posted by Lorizael
So is your argument that we should end the war because CNN is annoying?

I was never in favor of the war. I just didn't care about it.

Now I do, it is depressing.

JM

[Straybow]

Whiner.

[Jon Miller]

So? How does that change the war from being depressing? How is the war accomplishing anything? If it is depressing and not accomplishing anything, why should we continue it?

JM

[DaShi]

Don't we need a perpetual war in a foreign land to distract people from the problems at home? Those are depressing.

[Jon Miller]

If Americans want to volunteer to go die for American Imperialism I have no problem with that.

I do have a problem with us ****ing up other places... and forcing them to stay ****ed up (some ****ing with other countries is allowed because that is what countries do..).

Basically:
You want to attack Iraq.. OK (not in favor, but I didn't really care)
You **** up Iraq... Mistake
Iraq situation not getting any better by our continue presense... We should leave

JM

[Gatekeeper]

Originally posted by Rufus T. Firefly
Actually, it's a variation of Bush's recent argument that all Americans really are making sacrifices for the war, because we all have to listen to depressing news on tv.

I wish I were kidding.

I know you're not kidding, because I, too, heard Bush say it. When I did, I cringed and almost felt like holing up somewhere out of sight from the rest of the world.

My God. Sacrifices? The general American public has made sacrifices, Mr. Bush? I call BULLSH*T. The only people who have made any *real* sacrifices are the families of the men and women we've got fighting (and dying and being wounded) in Iraq and Afghanistan. The rest of us? Oh, yes, we've had to watch depressing news on television, read it in the newspapers and on the Internet, and listen to it on the radio. Yeah, that's some sacrifice, ain't it, folks?

Mr. Bush, your daddy knows what sacrifice is. Your father — former President George H.W. Bush — might have been born with a silver spoon in his mouth, but he *fought* in World War II. His bomber was shot down by the Japanese. He lost men under his command. Even if you disagree with the elder Bush's politics, it can't be denied that at least he of the Bush clan made sacrifices for his nation. Real sacrifices, unlike his inept son who now occupies the White House.

Mr. Bush, do you know who else knows what real sacrifices are? Tom Brokaw does. So does your father. They're "The Greatest Generation." They're my great-grandfathers, great-grandmothers, grandfathers and grandmothers.

They're the ones who lived on food and fuel rations while the consumer assembly lines were converted into fulltime war production lines. They're the ones who planted Victory Gardens in order to supplement their meager rations of food. They're the ones who hunted for loose bits of scrap metal to send in to the war plants, because *every* little bit helped. They're the ones who paid higher taxes, who endured price controls AND, on top of everything else, they're the ones who buried their sons, returning in coffins from the battlefields in Europe, the Pacific and elsewhere.

Mr. Bush, you say America and its allies are in a global struggle for the future, a War on Terrorism that has no end date and can rear up anywhere, anytime. If that's the case, why aren't you asking Americans to make real sacrifices? Why aren't the armament factories up and running? Where's the draft? Where's the genuine change — i.e. the Marshall Plan — in the Middle East, where our armies are? Maybe times have changed since World War II ended more than 60 years ago, but, c'mon! Getting tax cuts and being told to help the economy by shopping just doesn't seem like sacrifices to me.

Nor does making a "sacrifice" by experiencing the war via the media cut the mustard.

A somewhat disillusioned,

Gatekeeper

[Berzerker]

I don't (And never did) understand how it was suppose to protect us against Suicide bombers in the US.

They blow themselves up in Iraq instead of here

[Eli]

We should ramp up the culture slider by another 10%...

[Donegeal]

Re: I am tired of war

And I'm tired of posts like this that are proving the Muslim fanatics correct that the west is weak. We've broken a finger nail and people are screaming in fear becuase of the pampered life they've lead.

This is barely a war guys.

There have been 3,067 casualties in the Iraq "war" in a little over 3 years, and 352 in Afganistan over almost 6 years. That's 3,419 total over almost 6 years. That would put both conflicts together in the range of Spanish-American War (2,446 over 1 year) and the Phillippine War (4,196 over 4 years); and that was really just one conflict (from 1898 to 1902).

The media comparing this "war" with Vietnam is an insult to those who served their country during that conflict. There were 58,151 US casualties in the Vietnam War, and it took place over 9 years.

You wanna continue? Lets look at some of the real wars: WWI- 116,516 over 2 years; WWII- 405,399 over 4 years; Civil War- ~625,000 over 4 years. Those are wars.

This is barely a war.

Lets look at this from a population perspective.

Iraq: Pop- 300,000,000; Casualties 3,419
Vietnam: Pop- 203,211,926; Casualties 58,151
WWI: Pop- 106,021,537; Casualties 116,516
WWII: Pop- 151,325,798; Casualties 405,399
Civil War: Pop- 38,558,371; Casualties ~625,000

Is Iraq a meat grinder? Yes, but not for the US.

Two main things have happened since the US was involved in a real war:
1) Things are going so good for the US, that the media has to focus on something negative to get ratings. They choose loosing 10 soldiers in Iraq in a day; and the only reason that's a story is because...
2) The US has become so good at protecting it's soldiers that loosing 10 soldiers in a day is not common.

No Jon, you're not tired of war, you're tired of sensationalized media attempting to spin small things into big things for the all important rating.

[Kuciwalker]

This is a stupid war Donegeal. There's no reason to say "oh, we're only losing X guys a day so it's not that bad!" when there's no good reason for them to be there in the first place.

And consider that them being there has been a huge problem restricting our options for dealing with Iran.

[SlowwHand]

Entertaining to have facts presented for a change, instead of blubbering.

[DanS]

I view the Iraq theater of the war as a pissing match with big consequences. The U.S. has to prove that it can stick with a military action in the M.E. Unfortunately, the U.S. has a reputation in the region for lack of fortitude. War fatigue is an important part of that, but I note that war fatigue ebbs and flows.