Apolyton Votes!

[Kuciwalker]

Originally posted by Ogie Oglethorpe
Unnecessary cost burden especially for small publicly traded companies. Hasn't done diddly squat except add cost and fatten auditors pockets.

BS. I know a couple of cases where my dad put Sarbanes-Oxley to good use (though that's not his area).

[Kuciwalker]

Originally posted by Ogie Oglethorpe
Good you can read.

Now experience it first hand in practice.

OK. See above.

[Imran Siddiqui]

Sure it's wiki, but:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sarbanes-Oxley

The Sarbanes-Oxley Act's major provisions include:

* Creation of the Public Company Accounting Oversight Board (PCAOB)
* A requirement that public companies evaluate and disclose the effectiveness of their internal controls as they relate to financial reporting, and that independent auditors for such companies "attest" (i.e., agree, or qualify) to such disclosure
* Certification of financial reports by chief executive officers and chief financial officers
* Auditor independence, including outright bans on certain types of work for audit clients and pre-certification by the company's Audit Committee of all other non-audit work
* A requirement that companies listed on stock exchanges have fully independent audit committees that oversee the relationship between the company and its auditor
* Ban on most personal loans to any executive officer or director
* Accelerated reporting of trades by insiders
* Prohibition on insider trades during pension fund blackout periods
* Additional disclosure
* Enhanced criminal and civil penalties for violations of securities law
* Significantly longer maximum jail sentences and larger fines for corporate executives who knowingly and willfully misstate financial statements, although maximum sentences are largely irrelevant because judges generally follow the Federal Sentencing Guidelines in setting actual sentences
* Employee protections allowing those corporate fraud whistleblowers who file complaints with OSHA within 90 days to win reinstatement, back pay and benefits, compensatory damages, and congressional page abatement orders, and reasonable attorney fees and costs.

Yeah, I think I'll trade companies having to pay more for those protections, thank you very much. There should be more auditing done and more information should be made audit capable. Companies whining a bit more because they have to do that? I'm not sympathetic. And, of course, these audit costs will fall to an equilibrium as auditors and companies become more familiar with the law's requirements (though costs will still be higher, and for the return, I see no problem).

[Dis]

voted democrats for the national races, and republicans for the local goverment.

I voted for a democratic congressman (woman), Her hame is Tessa. I have no idea who she is. But I hear she's pretty, so it sounds like she's qualified to run the country. I only voted for her because she's a democrat.

[Ogie Oglethorpe]

Originally posted by Kuciwalker
[q]quote:
Originally posted by Ogie Oglethorpe
Good you can read.

Now experience it first hand in practice. [/q}

OK. See above.

So your dad's experience in the field is first hand experience, ehhh?

At best its second and most likely third hand experience.

[Odin]

My votes:


Governor: Mike Hatch, Democrat

US Senate: Amy Klobuchar, Democrat

US House, 7th District: Collin Peterson, Democrat

MN Senate, District 9: Keith Langseth, Democrat

MN House, district 9a: Diane Williams, Democrat

[KrazyHorse]

George F Allen (R)

MACACA!!!!

[DinoDoc]

Looks like Lieberman pwnd the Democrats.

[Pekka]

The SOX is party good, partly a miserable failure.

" * A requirement that public companies evaluate and disclose the effectiveness of their internal controls as they relate to financial reporting, and that independent auditors for such companies"

This one is problematic.... effectiveness of their internal controls.....

In this part, SOX sucks. No one is saying auditing is bad, no one is saying there shouldn't be internal controls. But there should be some limits, discussion and research as to what applies to the real world and what adds to the paper hell of France.

[Kuciwalker]

Originally posted by Ogie Oglethorpe
So your dad's experience in the field is first hand experience, ehhh?

At best its second and most likely third hand experience.

Um, no. It's first hand experience. My dad's a lawyer.

[Arrian]

I ended up voting most Democrat, with 2 Greens and a Libertarian mixed in. Not one vote for a Republican, which is a first for me.

-Arrian

[Admiral]

Originally posted by GePap
Voted Democrat down the line pretty much, but then I live in NYC.

If the Republican Gov. candidate had run instead for State Comptroller, I would have voted for him, but the guy decided to take on Spitzer even though it was clear from back in March that Spitzer would win, and win huge.

I found myself trying to persuade Democrats not to vote for Havesti.

[Ogie Oglethorpe]

Originally posted by Kuciwalker


Um, no. It's first hand experience. My dad's a lawyer.

Correct you dad's expereince is first hand. Your postulating on it is not.

[Kuciwalker]

My relation of it is.

[Pekka]

So I have a direct relation to a whole group fo experts with first hand experience on SOX, who have formed an expert kind of boards etc in the US and Europe, as they are security and audit experts. This increases THEIR business, yet they say there are some serious problems with it, the one I mentioned particular.

So, that's say, 4 or 5 experts on this issue with range of companies they work with vs one lawyer. Or is he a REALLY REALLY REALLY good lawyer? I bet he is but just saying, knowledge by association is a bad argument.

And, you have to understand that this has global meanings, this has extra-territorial power in it because you need to be compliant to this should you do business in US. EU has formed its own similar setup, Australia has one, but you always of course have to go with the most strict one when doing business in certain countries.

THis leads to a situation where security becomes an issue of accountants, who are happily claiming sometimes that they should be designing things, as they know what the SOX means, so we should just outsource security etc. THese are the real effects of SOX.

FUrthermore it's not exactly cheap or realistic for everyone to be in compliance with SOX, there's lots of problems with this baby.

It's definitely not a clear case of victory, it's a difficult issue as of moment and there's lots of problems related to this. Was some of these controls needed that SOX included, sure. Was it 100% a great idea, not necessarily.