Israel invades Lebanon after new capturing of soldiers

[MRT144]

because it doesnt matter if they break hezbollah in lebanon! It will come back! It wont go away if it still has support from other countries. other countries that actually support them materially and monetarially from locations not close to lebanon!

as soon as youve mopped up lebanon, you go after syria and iran but hezbollah will be back in southern lebanon. it requires an effort beyond what israel has, and what the world has the will to do sans nukes.

[notyoueither]

Simply brilliant. I don't know why you haven't run for office in Israel.

[Agathon]

Hey NYE.

Why don't you go down to your local Muslim grocer and shoot him in the face? After all he's a member of this violent and extreme religion you are hell bent on exterminating.

[notyoueither]

[MRT144]

youre telling me israel has the material and logistical means to continually break any resurgence of terrorist groups on two fronts without tackling the source of materials and money for these terrorist groups?

its not a cut and dry problem and solution that ends with the destruction of hezbollah, or palestine, or lebanon, or iran, or syria. its such a simplistic view of how terrorism works that fills you with optimisim. youre way smarter than that nye!

[MRT144]

revelation! perhaps it is cheaper to continually fight border wars with terrorist groups, but it certainly isnt a satisfactory solution to anyone involved!

[MRT144]

Originally posted by Agathon
Hey NYE.

Why don't you go down to your local Muslim grocer and shoot him in the face? After all he's a member of this violent and extreme religion you are hell bent on exterminating.

please tell me youve become a grocer and converted to islam. please.

[Agathon]

Originally posted by MRT144
revelation! perhaps it is cheaper to continually fight border wars with terrorist groups, but it certainly isnt a satisfactory solution to anyone involved!

A better revelation would be to realize that the Sharon/Olmert party has never been interested in a fair peace. Everything they have done is designed to provoke reactions that will justify them in forcing a unilateral solution to the Palestine problem. Anyone who can't see this is an idiot.

But this is all fine by me. The more Israel acts like a rogue state, the more support it loses.

[Sprayber]

Don't really know what to make of all this. I think that the strikes in S. Lebanon will probably be counterproductive and only satisify the need to lash out but realistically there wasn't much for Israel to do. Any reluctance on their part would have only encouraged more attacks.

Although.. Perhaps not all Arabs are tottally crazed and out for destruction.

When Israeli forces entered Gaza in late June, the news media in the Arab world spared no adjective to describe the "Zionist aggression," as the Syrian News Agency labeled it, or the "crazed racist extermination war," in the words of a writer in the Palestinian al-Ayyam paper. No observer of the Middle East would find that degree of invective and bitterness surprising.

However, buried below the furious, raging surface, a different sort of commentary flowed through the Internet.

In Arab blogs and deep inside the Web comment pages of some major news organizations, a few people dared to disagree. In fact, some Arab advocates of political and social reform saw recent events in the Palestinian territories as ammunition with which to criticize the dictatorial regimes they want to change in their own countries.

The Israeli incursion, with its controversial bombing of a Palestinian power plant, came less than three days after Palestinian militants dug a tunnel into Israel and captured 19-year-old Cpl. Gilad Shalit. About one year ago, Israel had completed a withdrawal from Gaza. This was the first major Israeli operation on that strip of land since the withdrawal and since the coming to power of Hamas, the Islamic Resistance Movement, considered a terrorist organization by Israel, the United States and the European Union.

Many -- though not all -- in the Arab blogosphere sharply criticized Israeli actions as excessive, but they saw in the fury of the Israeli government something lacking in their own: concern for the life of a single citizen. "They will turn the world upside down to get that soldier back," wrote Sandmonkey, who describes himself as 25-year-old Egyptian living in Cairo. "I kind of envy how much they care about their own." The sentiment was echoed by Isis, at BigPharaoh.com, wishing that "our government had half the respect" for its citizens' lives "that the Israelis have for theirs."

Lebanese bloggers found bitter irony in the failure of their leaders to accomplish very much and yet find the time to rhetorically blast Israel. Lebanonesque (lebanonesque.blogspot.com) printed a local news item about a meeting of the country's National Dialogue, which "failed to solve any of their own country's problems ... but they did manage to agree that the international community should step in to halt Israel's offensive in the Gaza Strip." A contributor noted sadly that "Arab 'leaders' are following in the grand tradition of posturing and emitting hot air while unable/unwilling to deliver bread to their own people."

Several progressive Arab blogs quoted approvingly from the comments page of the satellite news channel Al-Arabiya. An article titled "Where is the Arab Brain?" and signed by "A Wise Muslim" beseeched Arab leaders to stop supporting terrorism and start helping their own people. "The Arab leaders cheat and lie their people and make them holocaust fuel to their wars with Israel to divert their people from their national and democratic rights," the writer argues, adding, "Continuing the war with Israel is an advantage for Arab rulers and not their people."

Syrian democrats also maintain that their government should stop supporting terrorism, particularly by playing host to Hamas leaders. After Israeli jets entered Syrian airspace and flew low over the home of Syrian President Bashar Assad, someone identified only as Fares wrote at amarji.blogspot.com, a Syrian reformer's blog, "Now even myself for the first time ever I applaud an Israeli action. ... Israel by this action has shown that it does not want to harm Syria. ... (It is) time for Syrians to pick the message up and stop supporting radicals and terrorists."

A recurring theme among many who want regime change in their own countries is a demand that their leaders stop supporting terrorists.

Hamas itself came under withering fire from several writers, including many who expressed impassioned support for Palestinians. In the Al-Arabiya page, someone asked, "What did Hamas expect" when it took the Israeli soldier? With concern for the Palestinians and little sympathy for Israel, he cries out, "the people in Gaza have enough troubles than to be occupied again due to the stupid, irresponsible actions of Hamas idiots."

Hamas leaders fall into the same category as other regional governments that "enrich themselves and enlarge their external bank accounts" while speaking about the "glories of Jihad and martyrdom," was the sentiment in an article quoted in the blog "Free Michel Kilo Now," a site named after a Syrian writer taken prisoner by the authorities in a recent crackdown against the opposition.

The majority of the writing on Arab blogs and other Internet commentary was in support of the Palestinians and highly critical of Israel. Still, Arab democrats are increasingly noting that, however much anyone sympathizes with Palestinians, there is little doubt that Arab autocrats, dictators and assorted rulers-for-life have long used the Palestinian cause as a thick cloak to cover up the deficiencies of their rule.

The Internet, it seems, is slowly drawing the threads off that cloak, making it transparent enough to reveal the ugly truth. This time, even an Israeli crackdown in the Palestinian territories has provided an opportunity to bring more attacks against Arab regimes.

edit.. forgot the link http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/articl...NGIVJQ75J1.DTL

I actually read the article in the state wide paper the other day but found it here online..

[MRT144]

hamas is proof that terrorism and government dont work well together and weaken one another. they lose support on the political front and popular front because they are now solely accountable for whatever happens to its citizens.

[muxec]

People, did you read "Samson Blinded" http://samsonblinded.com/ ? Do it now.

[Ecthy]

muxec, people who are not aware of political realism and its implications shouldn't start by reading that book. It might blur their understanding of conflicts and lead to aggressive simplifications. I know what I speak of

[Spiffor]

Originally posted by Imran Siddiqui
Seems to be a tenuous hope there.

You have to remember one thing: the cost for Israel is nearly nil.

When an opportunity only costs some fuel and some bomb, it'll be pursued, even if tenuous. Israel has clearly shown it has no regard whatsoever for the economic well-being of the neighbouring populations. If anything, creating misery is seen as a gain by Israel.

[Ecthy]

Spiff, what kind of commie are you? These people fight for survival in a land full of maniacs.

To get started with realism, read the introductory chapters of standard books: Politics Among Nations by Morgenthau, and The Tragedy of Great Power Politics by Mearsheimer. I advise Mearsheimer and not Waltz because Mearsheimer's theory comes closer to that of Mr Jebediah Obadiah Springfield Shoher

[MRT144]

oh thank god, eurocoms to my rescue!