Should women be allowed entry into a shrine to male celibacy ?

[Lancer]

Originally posted by Wycoff
No, women shouldn't enter the temple. No one should enter a temple devoted to something as misguided and unnatural as celibacy.

Unnatural? Nature and the biological imperative to become part of the 'beast with two backs' is why we got people out the wazzoo eating out the earth, so to speak. If some few are wise enough to get control of their destiny by refusing the biological imperative, and have the power of self enough to overcome millions of years of conditioning, more power to em I say.

Remember, no life on this earth would exist if some decendant had failed to obey their program. That's a tough nut to crack.

[Wycoff]

Originally posted by Lancer
Unnatural? Nature and the biological imperative to become part of the 'beast with two backs' is why we got people out the wazzoo eating out the earth, so to speak. If some few are wise enough to get control of their destiny by refusing the biological imperative, and have the power of self enough to overcome millions of years of conditioning, more power to em I say.

You've confused two debates, as celibacy and birth control aren't the same thing.

The stupidity of enshrining celibacy as a religious value is simple. If a religion holds celibacy as a virtue, then logically a perfectlly practiced form of that religion would have every adherant practice celibacy. If every adherant practices celibacy, then that belief system dies out with its last member.

If the religion includes proselytization as a virtue, then the evils of celibacy are made worse. An idealized form of that proseltyizing religion would be a world in which every person perfectly followed that religion. If everyone in the world perfectly followed a religion that held celibacy as a virtue, then that religion would guarantee humanity's extinction within a human lifetime. For a person who values human survival, that seems to be the worst possible goal for a group to want to achieve.

In a pro-celebacy religion practiced perfectly, the end result is extinction. In a pro-celebacy religion imperfectly practiced, those who have sex are viewed as imperfect or failures. I value human survival, and I think sex is a good thing, or at least morally neutral, so I therefore find pro-celebacy revolting.

The difference between a celibacy system and a birth control system is that, in a celibacy system, people are bad if they have sex. In a birth control system anyone can have sex. Those who want children can have them, those who do not want them can choose not to have them, and no one is set off as inferior for having sex.

[Lorizael]

Bah. Human survival is overrated.

I used to think celibacy was crazy whacko stuff, too. But then some things happened to me and, well, it's still crazy whacko stuff, but so am I, so I actually understand the value behind the concept. Not that I practice it.

But the notion of a life dedicated to something other than the perceived constants we are inundated with can certainly be appealing. Being able to focus solely on the one purpose you "know" to be of true and absolute value. To have such control over your destiny, without worrying about the mundane concerns of life and your biological imperatives... would be nice.

[Dis]

Originally posted by Ecthy
Celibacy of 41 days? What a laugh...

I've done 21 years.

[Dis]

Originally posted by Wycoff
No, women shouldn't enter the temple. No one should enter a temple devoted to something as misguided and unnatural as celibacy.

Seriously, what is wrong with celibacy? I'm thinking about doing it.

I don't think you should ridicule other people just because they are different.

[Lancer]

Originally posted by Lorizael
Bah. Human survival is overrated.

I used to think celibacy was crazy whacko stuff, too. But then some things happened to me and, well, it's still crazy whacko stuff, but so am I, so I actually understand the value behind the concept. Not that I practice it.

But the notion of a life dedicated to something other than the perceived constants we are inundated with can certainly be appealing. Being able to focus solely on the one purpose you "know" to be of true and absolute value. To have such control over your destiny, without worrying about the mundane concerns of life and your biological imperatives... would be nice.

Couldn't have said it as well. Please continue, extrapolate, expand, fill my mind.

[Lancer]

What's the history that brought these exceptional concepts into your youthful mind?

[Wycoff]

Originally posted by Dis
I don't think you should ridicule other people just because they are different.

I'm not ridiculing people because they are different, I'm ridiculing a belief system because I find it abhorrent. I've set out my reasons why I think its wrong. That's what debate / discussion is all about, isn't it? Or have the rules around here changed?

[Mrs. Tuberski]

Dis if you really think about it in todays society celibacy is unnatural and misguided, just as most of all the other things that influence folks. It doesnt mean that it really is, and if one wants to practice that then so be it however just like other things i dont think it needs to be pushed upon the rest of the world that doesnt agree.
The bottom line for me is if women are banned from said temple then it should include all women not just the ones that can get pregnant.

[Dis]

I've finally realized women are evil. Yes I know, people have been telling me this all along.

This thread is proof. What good reason would a woman have for entering this temple?

[Dis]

Originally posted by Mrs. Tuberski
Dis if you really think about it in todays society celibacy is unnatural and misguided, just as most of all the other things that influence folks. It doesnt mean that it really is, and if one wants to practice that then so be it however just like other things i dont think it needs to be pushed upon the rest of the world that doesnt agree.
The bottom line for me is if women are banned from said temple then it should include all women not just the ones that can get pregnant.

I must have misread the post then. Sorry. just disregard all my comments in this thread.

I didn't realize they accepted some women in. What's the point in that? Silly religions.

[Lancer]

[Lorizael]

Originally posted by Lancer
What's the history that brought these exceptional concepts into your youthful mind?

I'd explain, but it would take awhile, and I'm at work. Also, I've got quite a phobia about doing do.

[Lancer]

I understand.

[Mrs. Tuberski]

Dis i wasnt so to speak dissing you all i was saying is that celibacy is both of the above. Unnatural cause it isnt practiced alot. misguided by the fact that the terms refers to not have sex. I personaly think masturbation to the end is a form of sex. self sex is not celibate you are simply refraing from having a partner.