Dubai Is Nuts!!!!

[Ecthy]

All this will not matter once they're all glassed.

[Bosh]

Originally posted by Drake Tungsten

Why Korea of course.

Japanese copying of Korean copying of China is still Japan copying China, I think.

But but early Japanese pots look a lot like early Korean pots! That proves that everything of value in Japanese culture must have come from Korea!

[Kuciwalker]

Originally posted by molly bloom
This is like saying that Gothic architecture is devalued by the numbers of structural failures in churches and cathedrals built in that style.

Architecture, no. Engineering, yes.

[laurentius]

Originally posted by Albert Speer
laurentius:

The modern Assyrians remained a distinct ethnicity only because their ancestors refused to convert to Islam and remained Eastern Christian. I'm sure the vast majority of Assyrians in the 7th century converted to Islam and became Arabized. Only Christian seperatist Assyrians retained an 'Assyrian' identity. The rest converted and became Arabs.

I dont see how such a conclusion can be reached. Nationality is much more than religion. Assyrians are not only christian, but also speak and write in languages different from Arabic. Of course some small chunks of the population have assimilated into the Islamic/Arabic culture during the centuries of oppression and forced conversions. And yes I admit that has been the sad fate of many other non-arabic people in that region

Tur Abdin is a monument to this destruction of the ancient people. Its predominantly muslim only because most of the remaining christian Assyrians were killed in the Armenian-Assyrian massacre in 1915.

[Drake Tungsten]

But but early Japanese pots look a lot like early Korean pots!

Not really. Yayoi-period pots do, but those aren't really early Japanese pots. Jomon-period pots are very distinctive and older than anything found in Korea (or anywhere else in the world, for that matter).

That proves that everything of value in Japanese culture must have come from Korea!

So they actually admit that there are thing of value in Japanese culture?

[Al B. Sure!]

laurentius:

Assyrians are not only christian, but also speak and write in languages different from Arabic.

exactly! These Christian Assyrians are similar to Egyptian Copts who speak ancient Egyptian and have ancient Egyptian customs and are a cultural remnant of ancient Egypt. The fact that they were Christians caused them to be distinct from the vast majority of Egyptians who converted to Islam.

Therefore, just as the Coptic nationality remained distinct because of religious segregation (partly self-imposed), the Assyrian nationality remained distinct among Assyrians who were Christians. This is a case of a small group of people X being of a seperatist sect and retaining the culture as a result of being of a seperatist religion.

How many Assyrians in 650 AD do you suppose were Christians? I suspect many more were Zoroastrians...

[molly bloom]

Originally posted by Albert Speer
molly:

daft? how? An Iraqi is as much a descendent of ancient Assyrians and Babylonians as he is of Arabs.

An Iraqi is not necessarily an Arab though.

Could be Kurd, Turcoman, Jew and so on. I note you don't claim that Arabs in the Lebanon can be proud of their Roman or Byzantine or Greek heritage, or that Arabs can be proud of the Achaemenid or Parthian heritage in Iran.


Odd, as all those places were part of the Caliphate too.

[Al B. Sure!]

I note you don't claim that Arabs in the Lebanon can be proud of their Roman or Byzantine or Greek heritage, or that Arabs can be proud of the Achaemenid or Parthian heritage in Iran.

blah? I did say that Lebanese are the descendents of Phoenicians and Canaanites...

[molly bloom]

Originally posted by aneeshm


The point is , the Indians did not voluntarily give that knowledge to the Arabs , because the learned were never persecuted in India , unlike as in the examples you gave . The knowledge was taken without consent , from looted libraries and captured civilians who did not want to go out of India but were forced to , at least when India fell within the ambit of the Muslim-ruled world .

Oh this is just so much propaganda and horse crap.

I'm getting really really bored with your constant anti-Islamic posts, which frequently fail to have any substantive evidence to back them up.


If you can show that all Islamic scientific knowledge that is based on, partly based on or even just acknowledges an Indian input was removed by force, either through looted texts or kidnapped scholars, then show us proof.

Failing that, why not enlighten us on the long-standing trading links between the Parthian and Sasanid Empires and the west coast of the Indian sub-continent ?

And the links between the Persian Gulf coast of Arabia and the southern Arabian kingdoms and the west and south coasts of India ?

[molly bloom]

Originally posted by aneeshm
As for the dam thing - Al Beruni , an Arab ( AFAIK , that is ) traveller to India said of Indian construction projects that Arab engineers could not even imagine them , much less build them .

al Biruni was of Iranian origin.

I fail to see how his opinon of Indian architecture has any bearing on the Marib dam. Let's see the quote in context in any case.

I'm sure you can tell us in great detail which Indian construction projects he had in mind.

[molly bloom]

Originally posted by Albert Speer


blah? I did say that Lebanese are the descendents of Phoenicians and Canaanites...

So let's see, the Canaanites and Phoenicians are now Arabs too ?


Your 'logic', for want of a better term gets even more skewed.


You'd be better off sticking with Semite if you want to cover all the relevant bases, since you can adequately group in the Sumerians, Aramaeans, Phoenicians, Jews and Arabs and still have room to spare.


Attempting to claim ancient non-Arab cultures for modern day 'Arabs' is just plain absurd.

Why stop in ancient history ?


Why not include the prehistoric site at Shanidar in Persian history or have Chinese proud of their Peking man history ?

I bet the Germans are real thrilled with their Homo Neanderthalensis heritage too.

[Al B. Sure!]

Molly:

we're talking great civilizations here with populations in the hundreds of thousands. Every Arab is a descendent of one of these ancient peoples whether Canaanites, Egyptians, Babylonians, or something else.

Greeks still associate themselves with the Classical Hellenic culture of 400 BC... Italians are proud of Roman culture... Irish are proud of ancient Celtic culture... how are any of these examples ANY different from an Arab (whose ancestors are likely not from the Arabian peninsula but are more likely the ancient inhabitants of Iraq, Lebanon, Egypt, etc.) taking pride in his ancient heritage which includes Babylon and Phoenicia?

[laurentius]

AS:

Ask yourself: Why dont the Turks take pride in Jonian Greek heritage?

[pchang]

If you don't have enough fish

throw a wider net

[lord of the mark]

Originally posted by molly bloom



As I recall when Japan was the hate figure (or hate country) in the 1980s, some Americans came out with that very nonsense, even supposedly having 'scientific' research that showed that the Japanese brains were hardwired genetically without some alleged creative ability.


Of course this was before the filthy Aye-Rabs, Aye-Rackeys and Al Kider became the new hate kids on the block.


Whatever did happen to the nasty ol' Japan that was buying up all of America and erecting those hateful trade barriers and buying Van Gogh paintings for ludicrous sums ?

It did, after all, give us the masterful literary work that is Michael Crichton's 'Rising Sun'...

Some of us actually took a stab at learning Japanese (ohio gozaimas) And studying "theory Z", and Total Quality Management, and the implications of Just in Time inventory management for the transportation industry. Or studying Japanese history with former Amb. Edwin Reischauer.

Of course we were by and large the same people who werent much into Tammy Fay.

I guess we arent "real Americans".

Just the red necks, and Michael Cricton.

I wonder though, how the EU managed to get all protectionist against Japan, without having Tammy Fay levels of vulgarity?