Heckling Rumsfeld!!

[MrFun]

Cheers to those who stood up and spoke their mind against Rumsfeld.

Link to video of heckling.

[chequita guevara]

And this is why the left is losing. Meanwhile, in the same conference (IIRC) this exchange between a former CIA analyst and the Secretary occured.

A question for Rumsfeld: "Why did you lie?"

What has Stephen Colbert wrought?

Donald Rumsfeld was interrupted by protesters several times today as he tried to deliver a speech in Atlanta. The interruptions were brief, but then a critic, former CIA employee Ray McGovern, managed to engage the defense secretary in an extended question-and-answer session about the war. It was the kind of confrontation Rumsfeld seldom faces on the Sunday talk shows he frequents, and it left him, at one point, both stammering and speechless.

Think Progress has the video. Here's the transcript:

Question: So I would like to ask you to be upfront with the American people: Why did you lie to get us into a war that was not necessary, that has caused these kinds of casualties? Why?

Rumsfeld: Well, first of all, I haven't lied ... I'm not in the intelligence business. They gave the world their honest opinion. It appears that there were not weapons of mass destruction there.

Question: You said you knew where they were.

Rumsfeld: I did not. I said I knew where suspect sites were and --

Question: You said you knew where they were: Tikrit, Baghdad, northeast, south, west of there. Those are your words.

Confronted with his own words -- McGovern was quoting from Rumsfeld's March 2003 appearance on ABC's "This Week," during which he said unequivocally that the United States knew where Saddam's WMD were -- Rumsfeld appeared flummoxed. He stammered, "My words -- my words were that --," and then it's unclear what happened next. CNN's camera remained focused on Rumsfeld rather than McGovern, but it appears from Rumsfeld's words that somebody tried to take away McGovern's microphone or remove him from the room. To his credit, Rumsfeld stopped whatever it was from happening.

Rumsfeld: No, no, wait a minute, wait a minute. Let him stay one second. Just a second.

Question: This is America.

Rumsfeld: You're getting plenty of play, sir.

Question: I'd just like an honest answer.

Rumsfeld: I'm giving it to you.

Question: Well we're talking about lies and your allegation there was bulletproof evidence of ties between al-Qaida and Iraq.

Rumsfeld: Zarqawi was in Baghdad during the prewar period. That is a fact.

Question: Zarqawi? He was in the north of Iraq in a place where Saddam Hussein had no rule. That's also --

Rumsfeld: He was also in Baghdad.

Question: Yes, when he needed to go to the hospital. Come on, these people aren't idiots. They know the story.

Rumsfeld: Let me give you an example. It's easy for you to make a charge, but why do you think that the men and women in uniform every day, when they came out of Kuwait and went into Iraq, put on chemical-weapon-protective suits? Because they liked the style? They honestly believed that there were chemical weapons. Saddam Hussein had used chemical weapons on his own people previously. He'd used them on his neighbor ... and they believed he had those weapons. We believed he had those weapons.

Question: That's what we call a non sequitur. It doesn't matter what the troops believe; it matters what you believe.

And with that, the moderator cut off McGovern's questioning, saying that he had to turn to other audience members with questions as a "courtesy" to all of them. Good thing, too, because you certainly wouldn't want to be "rude" in a situation like this.

[MrFun]

Originally posted by chegitz guevara
And this is why the left is losing. Me

Why don't you think heckling can be an effective form of protest?

[chequita guevara]

Not really, no. It's just masturbation.

[Rufus T. Firefly]

Originally posted by MrFun


Why don't you think heckling can be an effective form of protest?

What the Bush administration and its media lackeys have done, very effectively, is treat rational discourse as the enemy of their agenda. They've accomplished what they have not with thoughtful argument and insight, but with fear, arrogance, and, when all else failed, the political equivalent of sticking their fingers in their ears and yelling "la-la-la-la I can't hear you."

Heckling is playing this game. And it is stupid to play this game with the people who've mastered it.

The enemies of the Bush administration are Fact, Logic, and Accountability. The exchange Che posted is an excellent example. Helen Thomas's recent questioning of the President is an excellent example. Colbert's routine at the dinner is an excellent example.

But heckling? Plays right into the Bush script that his opponents aren't fit to lead.

[MOBIUS]

So don't go into politics Mr Fun...

[Berzerker]

Rumsfeld: No, no, wait a minute, wait a minute. Let him stay one second. Just a second.

So, kick him out when I'm done? And that bit about the troops
is They're told to wear the stuff, is Rummy suggesting they had the same intel as he did and just decided it would be safer to wear protective gear? They were more in danger of our bombs releasing the stuff than Saddam using it on us (if it existed). Iraq didn't use the stuff on us in 2 wars when our troops were right there on the battlefield, and we're supposed to believe Saddam was a threat? Olberman ran the clip tonite, and it was good.

[Elok]

I--ugh!--agree with Che. The questioning by informed people is good. Heckling is idiotic and pointless. The Bush administration benefits tremendously from the presence of uneducated reactionaries frothing at the mouth over their latest visit to www.moveon.org or wherever. They can counter with their own pet rabid troublemakers, such as Ann Coulter, continuing the long, pointless name-calling war that's been building up in American discourse for years now. Bush's term of office will end long before the left's idiots manage to outshout the right's strategic slogan-chanter reserve. Not that they ever will.

[Imran Siddiqui]

And MrFun gets pwned . Heckling just plays into the Bush Administration's tactic of portraying all those against his views as crazy radicals who don't deserve to be listened to. For example, see how Coulter portrays those who heckle her, saying they are not interested in debate and realize they are wrong, so they heckle. If the opponents engage in rational debate and resist the temptation to heckle and yell, the Administration can't cope.

[Dinner]

Agreed but try to tell that to the DU people.

[MrFun]

So if heckling does no good, why was Rumsfeld crimson in the face, and obviously flustered and caught off guard?

But on the other hand, I guess I get you guys' point that afterwards, when they recover from the surprise, Bush and his cronies can put a more effective spin on any heckling incident.

[Berzerker]

because someone with knowledge stood up and asked embarassing questions

[Sava]

heckling is good if they started chanting "a^%hole" or something

[Elok]

If they can pronounce a caret and a percentage mark without sounding ludicrous, more power to them.

[Dinner]

A Claret? Always liked them myself.