"Brittish" Death Squads to Infiltrate Israel

[lord of the mark]

Originally posted by Sandman


That's not really accurate. I'd say 'bantustan' is a better description than concentration camp. Mass murder? Nah. And they do hire them, for building settlements and other menial jobs.

Mr Olmert has not yet laid out a map. However it will almost certainly leave the majority of the West Bank in Palestinian hands. Including the areas where most Palestinians live.

The borders he will propose for a unilateral withdrawl will certainly be less generous thant those that would be possible through negotiation. That could hardly be otherwise.

If the Palestinians want to negotiate their boundaries with Israel, Israel is eager to discuss them. Unfortunately the newly elected Palestinian govt wont accept the Oslo accords, the de minimus basis for a negotiations with Israel.

[lord of the mark]

Originally posted by Son of David




May God bless them and prosper them in every thing they do.

I may join them to live there one day, God willing.

you may be disappointed about territory. Despite what some here are saying, its expected that Olmert will move to annex only a few major settlement blocks, most near the green line. That would be the Gush etzion, Ariel, Maaleh Adumim, and a few others. He probably wont pull out of the Jordan Valley, but wont build up there either.

[lord of the mark]

Originally posted by Arrian
As if there isn't as much or more influence that is pro-Israeli? Come on!

Not at universities. From what i can gather since the second intifada began many American univerisities have become very uncomfortable places for anyone with Zionist leanings.

[Sandman]

Originally posted by lord of the mark
Mr Olmert has not yet laid out a map. However it will almost certainly leave the majority of the West Bank in Palestinian hands. Including the areas where most Palestinians live.

The borders he will propose for a unilateral withdrawl will certainly be less generous thant those that would be possible through negotiation. That could hardly be otherwise.

If the Palestinians want to negotiate their boundaries with Israel, Israel is eager to discuss them. Unfortunately the newly elected Palestinian govt wont accept the Oslo accords, the de minimus basis for a negotiations with Israel.

8% more bantustan is still a bantustan.

[lord of the mark]

Originally posted by Sandman


8% more bantustan is still a bantustan.

Im confused. So youre saying if Israel gave up the entire West Bank it would still be a bantustan? that a pal state would only cease to be a bantustan if Israel ceased to exist?

[GhengisFarb™]

Originally posted by Sandman


That's not really accurate. I'd say 'bantustan' is a better description than concentration camp. Mass murder? Nah. And they do hire them, for building settlements and other menial jobs.

Your absolutely correct, I used a very liberal amount of "poetic license" in my description. I still have a hard time justifing a lot of Israel's actions though.

[Sandman]

Originally posted by lord of the mark
Im confused. So youre saying if Israel gave up the entire West Bank it would still be a bantustan? that a pal state would only cease to be a bantustan if Israel ceased to exist?

No. Don't be silly. Some sort of control over water, boundaries, airspace, that sort of thing.

[Arrian]

Originally posted by GhengisFarb

Your absolutely correct, I used a very liberal amount of "poetic license" in my description. I still have a hard time justifing a lot of Israel's actions though.

Farb and his liberal bashing It never ends.



-Arrian

[Thorn]

Sounds like one of those Zionist conspiricy theories to me..... Like Britian is going to invade Israel and start gassing people, wtf... is wrong with you people.........!!

[GhengisFarb™]

Originally posted by Arrian


Farb and his liberal bashing It never ends.



-Arrian

I thought you said I WAS a liberal!

[Arrian]

Well you must be a self-hating liberal, then.

-Arrian

[GhengisFarb™]

I thought "self-hating" was part of the basic definition of being a Liberal.

Along with "always wrong", "clueless", and "welfare."

[Cort Haus]

Originally posted by lord of the mark
From what i can gather since the second intifada began many American univerisities have become very uncomfortable places for anyone with Zionist leanings.

I cannot claim to be be acquainted with policies of US universities, but I am familiar with one left-leaning acedemic, Francisco J. Gil-White, who I think lost his job at the University of Pennsylvania for having a pro-Israeli perspective. Whether this is categorised as 'Zionist' leanings I cannot say, but I gather that he was pro-Palestinian until 2002, when he changed his mind on the history of the region.

The website that ran a defence campaign is no longer doing so - perhaps because he has been irrevocably sacked, but his excellent and illuminating series of articles 'Whitewashing the Palestinian Leadership' is now available at http://www.israelnationalnews.com/author.php?id=52

There is also an article called Impunity for anti-semitism at Penn and a current one called Reply to Mearsheimer & Walt's "The Israel Lobby" which is very topical.

[Cort Haus]

Something worth adding here - a lot of people get annoyed that criticism of the Israeli government is denounced in some quarters as anti-semitic, as they have absolutely nothing aginst Jewish people, but disagree with the policies of the Israeli government.

I can understand where some of these people are coming from, as I am in no way anti-american, but I strongly disagree with many aspects of the Foreign Policy of the US government. Anyone who has read my contributions to threads about the former Yugoslavia will know this. I have strong objections to my own, British government in this respect too.

However, as a person with a leftist history myself who has only come to understand the Israeli point of view in recent years, I feel obliged to say that a substantial amount of the criticism of Israeli actions in the conflict with the Palestinians is based on a distorted history of that conflict - a distortion propagated in part by a well-meaning but misinformed left, who see Israel as an imperialist, colonial oppressor and aggressor, and the Palestinian movement as a legitimate 3rd world anti-imperialist struggle.

Through this lens of 'anti-imperialism', a lot of propaganda which ultimately comes from deeply reactionary forces, including genuinely anti-semitic right wing and Islamist movements, has become popular currency. I'm not suggesting that all actions of all Israeli governments are beyond reproach, but I am saying that many popular notions of Middle Eastern history are based on lies, and specifically, Big Lies that exist to delegitimise the state of Israel and lend credence and support to calls for its destruction.

I do not believe that Israel is the original aggressor, I believe that Israel is defending itself against a real and genuine existential threat, and has had to do so since its birth. Nor do I believe that Israel was a creation of the imperialist states. There is no doubt in my mind that the destruction of Israel would not only be catastrophic to Israelis and Jewish people world-wide, but to Western civilisation as a whole.

If anyone is interested in information linking the roots of the Palestinian movement with the Nazi party, let me know - but some of Mr Gil-White's articles I linked to above are a good place to start, specifically this one.

[Pekka]

Naah.. why would they come to Israel? They're living in UK, watching football, eating fish and chips, drinking non-alcoholic cider, getting better opportunities for their children to prosper and grow in safer environment.. hey they went there on their own will. Why would they come back only to die in Israel?

Naah.. they can't miss the coming world cup in Germany anyway.