Dropout Nation

[Dinner]

I'm not sure what percentage of dropouts later return to get a GED. The Time article said that funding for second chance programs (basically programs where which try to get dropouts back in school or at least to get a GED) has dropped from $15 billion per year in the 1970's to just $3 billion per year in the most recent budget. Those are not inflation adjusted terms so really the spending has dropped much more then the 80% which those numbers imply.

[Dinner]

Originally posted by Drake Tungsten

The basic ugly reality, which I note you keep ignoring, is we don't spend nearly enough on education and the money we do spend seems to go to the wrong things.

That's not demonstrably true at all...

I fixed it so that the whole quote was there instead of allowing you to cherry pick just half of a quote. BTW the quote is entirely demonstrable because students don't have up to date textbooks so either we aren't spending enough or we're spending money on the wrong things.

[Az]

Originally posted by KrazyHorse

many kids drop out or never even go to high school, choosing a technical school instead

Technical school

yep. I was baffled by his comment. I went to a technical school. So what?

[Dr Strangelove]

Originally posted by TCO
Well, we WERE talking about the damn national figures. Localities...well...they're ****ed.

I was considering both of Oerdin's first posts.

Looking at the US census bureau website it appears that the Time article may be less than accurate. In the 2000 census ~75% of people age 18 to 24 had graduated high school or the equivalency. Better than 80% of the population age 25 had high school graduation or equivalency. Breaking that down by race 85% of whites, 72% of blacks and 53% of hispanics age 25 or over had high school graduation or equivalency. Furthermore among the subsets of population 25 to 34, 35 to 44 and 45 to 64 about 85% had high school equivalency, bu in the population over 65 only 65% had high school or equivalency. Looking at past census it appears that the portion of the population reaching high school graduation or equivalency has risen for every decade for the past 50 years. In the 1990 census only 75% of the population 25 or over had attained high school equivalency, and so on and so on.

[Dinner]

I imagine Time is correct about the numbers who dropout but I suspect what's happening is that many of these dropouts later get a GED thus putting them in the "or equivalency" part of the "high school graduation or equivalency". Either that or some portion of the population maybe lying on their census forms.

[General Ludd]

Droping out.


Highschool is ridiculously overrated.

[Dr Strangelove]

Originally posted by Oerdin
I imagine Time is correct about the numbers who dropout but I suspect what's happening is that many of these dropouts later get a GED thus putting them in the "or equivalency" part of the "high school graduation or equivalency". Either that or some portion of the population maybe lying on their census forms.

So what is the source of Time's data? Is it likely to be better than the US Census bureau's?

[Dinner]

I'm not sure what their source is. Popular media sources like Time don't often have a works cited page. It is the amount quoted in the article though as you can see by following the link in the OP.

[MRT144]

I'm a high school dropout, but that doesnt mean life is over for me. I think part of it is not resigning yourself to mediocrity despite the choices youve made.

Now I didnt drop out of high school for purely academic reasons, much of it was social, and disciplinary, but unfortunately I dont think most students are in my situation.

[Dr Strangelove]

Originally posted by Oerdin
I'm not sure what their source is. Popular media sources like Time don't often have a works cited page. It is the amount quoted in the article though as you can see by following the link in the OP.

I'm not about to register to read the whole article. If they don't cite their source then we can't judge it's credibility. The US census bureau also collects data from different questiosn and different sources. They also collect data about the number of high school degrees and equivalency certificates granted by various states. This data seems to be consistent with the data gathered from the special questionnaires.

[TCO]

Ok, doc. However, still emphasize that to understand an average (local or national), you can get there by sampling rather then census. you would need to make sure that the methodology takes care of transplants.

[Dinner]

Originally posted by MRT144
I'm a high school dropout, but that doesnt mean life is over for me. I think part of it is not resigning yourself to mediocrity despite the choices youve made.

Now I didnt drop out of high school for purely academic reasons, much of it was social, and disciplinary, but unfortunately I dont think most students are in my situation.

True, but the likelihood of a dropout finding a $60k per year job at an automobile plant just isn't that good these days. The likelihood of a college graduate finding a $60k per year job is actually expected in most technical fields (science & engineering) and not all that uncommon even for people with nontechnical degrees.

[MRT144]

high school dropouts can still go to college. but I think most people give up on that dream after dropping out.

[Darius871]

Originally posted by flash9286
If American parents actually took a interest in their kids education and pushed them to do their homework and etc, education would be a lot better in America.

That's about all it boils down to, and no amount of will fix it. Cultural problems don't vanish overnight.

[Drake Tungsten]

I fixed it so that the whole quote was there instead of allowing you to cherry pick just half of a quote. BTW the quote is entirely demonstrable because students don't have up to date textbooks so either we aren't spending enough or we're spending money on the wrong things.

Your statement didn't have an "or" in it originally. You said that we were both spending too little money and spending it on the wrong things. I didn't take issue with the latter point, as I agree with you to a certain extent, but my experience in Japan has led me to believe that the former point is just flawed conventional wisdom with little basis in fact.

yep. I was baffled by his comment. I went to a technical school. So what?

What's so baffling about it? In Japan, kids who aren't cut out for or interested in college prep work go to industrial, agricultural or other technical schools. I think it's a good idea and probably helps to lower the drop-out rate in the standard high schools. Technical schools...