The story of Purim.... why did they kill Haman(boo!)'s sons?

[lord of the mark]

Originally posted by KrazyHorse
Reification would mean that I believed in the concrete existence of religions rather than simply using the concept as a holding pen for a large class of behaviour...

like this by sandman?


"religions need followers "


for that not to be reification, requires a definition of a religion different from yours. It was with that definition that i was largely taking issue.

[KrazyHorse]

Why does Haman wear a triangular hat, by the way? What the **** is the point of writing that down?

[lord of the mark]

Originally posted by KrazyHorse
Why does Haman wear a triangular hat, by the way? What the **** is the point of writing that down?

First question - i dont know
Second - If you look at it,the scroll of esther really isnt a historical narrative like, say, the book of kings, and its not a book of laws, and its certainly not a prophetic book. Its more of a novel, a romance in the literary sense. The hat is a detail that adds flavo(u)r to the story. The rabbis who defined the biblical cannon seem to me to have been eager to include much of the core literay cannon of their civ, religious or not, and so included not only megillat Esther, but secular poetry like the song of songs. But being a "religious" civilization, we even managed to give a religious twist to Shir ha Shirim, and that is a valid part of Judaism, as is the secular interpretation.



Third - if no three cornered hat, no hamentaschen. Reason enough right there. BTW Apricot>Poppyseed>Chocolate. had a choc hamentasch for the first time last night. Who would have though chocolate could be so abused? Tradition is superior, once again


Fourth - actually im not sure the hat IS in the text. I think it the story that he had a three corned hat originated later, AFTER the pastry.

[KrazyHorse]

I didn't get any hamentaschen because Lonny hates it. His mom sent him sugar cookies instead. Those were pretty good.

He had to dress up like Haman and scare little kids. Apparently he made them cry.

[Sandman]

Originally posted by lord of the mark
The particular concept of "religion" is of course one thats used by most Jews - we use lots of foreign concepts. However its one that doesnt fit Jewish civilization all that well, and that leads to much confusion - largely, IMO, because it is a foreign concept.

If it's used by most Jews, how can it be a 'foreign' concept?

[lord of the mark]

Originally posted by Sandman


If it's used by most Jews, how can it be a 'foreign' concept?

Well, its not used in definitional Jewish texts. Its used by the majority of English speaking Jews, but its not well integrated into Jewish civilization. Its certainly useful when describing say Christianity or Islam, and almost all english speaking Jews would use it for Christianity and Islam. Some Jews wouldnt use to describe anything in Jewish civilization. Some Jews would use it carefully, the way KH is doing. Some, out of ignorance of Jewish civilization, would use it in ways that imply Judaism is a "religion" like Christianity.

Im sorry if youre stuck on my use of the word "foreign" If you wish you may substitute "a word of foreign origin, which describes the realities of the civilization in which it originates, and is misleading in understanding Jewish civilization" Thats a lot of typing though.

[lord of the mark]

Originally posted by KrazyHorse
He had to dress up like Haman and scare little kids. Apparently he made them cry.

Eh? when I was growing up nobody dressed as Haman - boys were Mordechai or Ahausverus (of course i know more about what Ahaveros was like now ) Today in my shul the kids all dress up as spiderman, harry potter, whatever - we still get a few Queen Esthers, but not many. So who made him dress up as Haman?

[lord of the mark]

Originally posted by KrazyHorse
I didn't get any hamentaschen because Lonny hates it. His mom sent him sugar cookies instead. Those were pretty good.

Sending of sweets of all kinds is traditional, called shlach manos. (Also to give charity - both are mentioned in the book of Esther) Of course this is a few weeks before Passover, when youve already got a lot of chometz to use up (if youre not "selling" it or giving it away, of course)

[KrazyHorse]

Originally posted by lord of the mark


Eh? when I was growing up nobody dressed as Haman - boys were Mordechai or Ahausverus (of course i know more about what Ahaveros was like now ) Today in my shul the kids all dress up as spiderman, harry potter, whatever - we still get a few Queen Esthers, but not many. So who made him dress up as Haman?

He works at a synagogue and apparently all the staff there were given a character from the story to dress up as. My two roommates were both Hamans.

[lord of the mark]

Originally posted by KrazyHorse


He works at a synagogue and apparently all the staff there were given a character from the story to dress up as. My two roommates were both Hamans.

which shul, may I ask? I know most of the shuls in Baltimore.

[Jon Miller]

It seems according to nonChristians that the only religions are Christianity and Islam.

I have noted this from Hindus also.

What I think they are noting is just the difference between older religions and newer religions.

JM

[KrazyHorse]

Originally posted by lord of the mark


which shul, may I ask? I know most of the shuls in Baltimore.

No idea what the name is. Right near the BHU though. Up in NW baltimore

[lord of the mark]

Originally posted by Jon Miller
It seems according to nonChristians that the only religions are Christianity and Islam.

I have noted this from Hindus also.

What I think they are noting is just the difference between older religions and newer religions.

JM

Nah, from me i was just treating Judaism differently. There may well be other "religions" its just that Ch and Is are the ones English speaking Jews are most likely to be thinking of. I think Hinduism is a whole nother thing, actually.

[lord of the mark]

Originally posted by KrazyHorse


No idea what the name is. Right near the BHU though. Up in NW baltimore

Is it big or small? Reform? Conservative? Orthodox? Is it on Park Heights Ave? Cause there are more shuls in NW baltimore than in the rest of metro baltimore combined, I think.

[KrazyHorse]

No ****ing clue. I can ask when I see him later

I'm going to guess that it's pretty big, though. Lonny teaches grade 3s, Ben teaches grade 5s, and I think they each have like 20-30 kids