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Retitled: Modern philosophers are full of it!

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  • Originally posted by Last Conformist
    Sending people to the moon is the greatest technological achiement ever? Frankly, Aggie, you're an idiot. Not that that's news, I suppose.

    Apollo was chiefly a triumph of economics and bureaucracy.
    Still sore from being *****-slapped in the last philosophy thread?

    I can't think of any other project that was as large and so involved. Feel free to come up with an alternative.
    Only feebs vote.

    Comment


    • Originally posted by Agathon
      On another note, it is amusing to see proponents of technology who have such a low opinion of philosophy and the arts, when the greatest technological achievement in history was really effected for no reason other than to provide a transformative experience to humanity, which is exactly what good philosophy and good art do.

      People have given all sorts of spurious reasons why we sent people to the moon. Some of them (science, politics) were contributing factors, but the real reason is that human beings have always desired the transformative experience: the experience that enlarges our sense of what is humanly possible and which gives us a new take on ourselves and the world. Going to the moon is just a really difficult and expensive way to do it. Art and philosophy do the same thing, in different ways.

      I love seeing science people complain about the arts and laud the moonshot. It's hypocrisy of the highest degree.
      Gee and here I thought it was simply for geopolitics to show the USSR/world the US was not technologically disadvantaged when it came to the likes of ICBM's and nuke delivery capability.

      A veritable mine is bigger than yours contest. If thats your idea of art, strike that it probably is.
      "Just puttin on the foil" - Jeff Hanson

      “In a democracy, I realize you don’t need to talk to the top leader to know how the country feels. When I go to a dictatorship, I only have to talk to one person and that’s the dictator, because he speaks for all the people.” - Jimmy Carter

      Comment


      • Originally posted by GePap
        You are an idiot, aren't you? I assume in your relationships you are the ones with the looks, cause you better not be the one with the brains...
        While I find it oddly revolting that you find me attractive, the good thing about gay relationships is we can have it both ways.

        BY your "logic", the fact she had a degree from the Sloan School of Business at MIT, one of the most prestigious business schools in the world, or the fact that she oversaw the spin-off of Lucent Technologies from AT&T are also irrelevant..and have no bearing on her, her qualities, or her experiences...no, simply her undergraduate degree matters in this discussion.

        All I can see is a rather pathetic attempt to make links that logic would show simply do not exist.
        You and your cronies are doing an admirable job of obfuscating the situation and playing with semantics -- a quality I find among virtually every person in the Philosophy department, as luck would have it.

        Here's the facts: You all know my position on philosophy in public university. It is a waste of public money. There is nothing to be gained from the department except a bunch of people using OUR tax money for THEIR personal interest and nothing more.

        You get the undergrads like Fiorina which never utilize their undergrad degree, making it, as you say, irrelevant. The people's money into studying undergrad philosophy is at a waste.

        Then you have the graduates like Agathon, who spend all day jerking off to Plato trying to wring something new or insightful from it, or otherwise pretending that further analysis of Plato will somehow revolutionize the world or further our understanding of mankind. Another waste of public money.

        So, you can argue that Carly's undergrad degree was completely independent of her abilities in the real world. This is door 1. Door 1 means that money on her undergraduate degree was wasted.

        Or you can argue that Carly's undergrad degree helped influence her decision making and critical thought, which is what you guys usually take as a position for backing for philosophy. This is door 2. In this case, it falls flat on its face again -- she not only lacks a real understanding of how businesses work, she made some of the most inept mind-boggling decisions in the history of CEOs. She's going down in the history books in the "negative" column. Door 2 means that money on her undergraduate degree was wasted.

        So which door is it? Did her Philosophy degree have no impact on her roles in the real world, or did it have an impact, allowing her to smash a once-mighty company into the ground?
        "The issue is there are still many people out there that use religion as a crutch for bigotry and hate. Like Ben."
        Ben Kenobi: "That means I'm doing something right. "

        Comment


        • Originally posted by nostromo
          And your having problems differenciating twirps who major in Philosophy and philosophers. Philosophers have obtained graduate degrees in philosophy, they usually work in philosophy departments, where they teach philosophy and do some research in philosophy, which they publish in good journals.
          So even if she had only a major in philosophy, she wouldn't be a philosopher. A philosopher does research in philosophy for a living, just like a physicist does research in physics for a living.
          That's f*cking bull****, a philosopher is a student of philosophy and a physicist is a student of physics.

          It does not imply graduate or post-graduate level only, just like how I'm a computer scientist with just a bachelor's degree.

          This is a disgusting attempt at weasling and semantics on your part, and yet again is classic of what we see from students of Philosophy these days.
          "The issue is there are still many people out there that use religion as a crutch for bigotry and hate. Like Ben."
          Ben Kenobi: "That means I'm doing something right. "

          Comment


          • Originally posted by GePap
            On another note on this post.

            Your arguement, of we can call it that, was that her failure at head of HP was related, if not a caused by, her undergraduate degree in Philosophy.

            For you to agree with my statement that that degree was irrelevant to her tenure at HP is for you to invalidate your own arguement.

            Good job
            As you'll see from my post, the whole point was to trap you into a corner.

            Her degree was either irrelevant to her job (a waste of money), or relevant to her job but the teachings terrible (a waste of money).

            You have nowhere to go but down. Did her degree matter, or not?

            As with the cast of the VAST majority of people who major in Philosophy, the degree will never matter in their life, because it is useless and a waste of public money.

            If you were a tad bit more attentive you would've seen this trap before you willingly walked into it...
            "The issue is there are still many people out there that use religion as a crutch for bigotry and hate. Like Ben."
            Ben Kenobi: "That means I'm doing something right. "

            Comment


            • Originally posted by nostromo
              Second, my point is that I don't see how her major in medieval philosophy could have possibly been the cause of her bad business decisions
              Please be a good Philosopher and read the supplied literature.

              She did a double major: Medieval History and Philosophy. This does not imply she only studied medieval philosophy...
              "The issue is there are still many people out there that use religion as a crutch for bigotry and hate. Like Ben."
              Ben Kenobi: "That means I'm doing something right. "

              Comment


              • Originally posted by Agathon
                I love seeing science people complain about the arts and laud the moonshot. It's hypocrisy of the highest degree.
                The only person I see mentioning arts here is you, curiously.

                Yet another example of a Philosopher deploying smoke and mirrors and strawmen to obfuscate the uselessness of your field today.
                "The issue is there are still many people out there that use religion as a crutch for bigotry and hate. Like Ben."
                Ben Kenobi: "That means I'm doing something right. "

                Comment


                • Originally posted by Agathon
                  Still sore from being *****-slapped in the last philosophy thread?

                  I can't think of any other project that was as large and so involved. Feel free to come up with an alternative.
                  How about a project that has actually done more for humanity? The Internet

                  Comment




                  • Who's next? Bring it on!
                    "The issue is there are still many people out there that use religion as a crutch for bigotry and hate. Like Ben."
                    Ben Kenobi: "That means I'm doing something right. "

                    Comment


                    • Originally posted by Ogie Oglethorpe


                      Gee and here I thought it was simply for geopolitics to show the USSR/world the US was not technologically disadvantaged when it came to the likes of ICBM's and nuke delivery capability.

                      A veritable mine is bigger than yours contest. If thats your idea of art, strike that it probably is.
                      And of course we should always expect this sort of bovine cogitation from you.

                      Go back to school and bother me when you have actually learned to read.
                      Only feebs vote.

                      Comment


                      • Originally posted by Asher

                        As you'll see from my post, the whole point was to trap you into a corner.

                        Her degree was either irrelevant to her job (a waste of money), or relevant to her job but the teachings terrible (a waste of money).

                        You have nowhere to go but down. Did her degree matter, or not?

                        As with the cast of the VAST majority of people who major in Philosophy, the degree will never matter in their life, because it is useless and a waste of public money.

                        If you were a tad bit more attentive you would've seen this trap before you willingly walked into it...
                        Sad little boy.

                        Its trully pitiful when you think you actually said anything of intelliegence. You look even more deluded when that happens.

                        Most humanities bachelors degrees have little to do with the jobs that people end up taking, specially because jobs in the humanities are difficult to find or exist in businesses where there is little job security.

                        That means that most English majors don't end up being Writers, most HIstory majors certainly don't end up being Historians, and most Philosophy majors don't end up being philosophers.

                        Given your rather limited life experiences, this reality might have eluded you before, but, there you go.

                        I am sure in your sadly small minded world that is a terrible thing, that people may actually change paths through life- i guess they are not as "smart as you"

                        And, as always, your rant is sadly devoid of well, logic, or a meaningful arguement. It boils down to, you don't understand philosophy, so you dislike it. Much like a monkey who can't figure out something might bang it angrily.

                        Poor little monkey.
                        If you don't like reality, change it! me
                        "Oh no! I am bested!" Drake
                        "it is dangerous to be right when the government is wrong" Voltaire
                        "Patriotism is a pernecious, psychopathic form of idiocy" George Bernard Shaw

                        Comment


                        • Originally posted by GePap


                          Sad little boy.
                          You didn't need go any further than that

                          Comment


                          • And, as always, your rant is sadly devoid of well, logic, or a meaningful arguement. It boils down to, you don't understand philosophy, so you dislike it. Much like a monkey who can't figure out something might bang it angrily.
                            That's never even been mentioned, so that's you pretending to read something that's not being said again.

                            You've just demonstrated admirably that public money is being wasted on twits like you to study Philosophy in university just so you can become a civil servant for a city and never use it again in your life. It becomes, as you say, irrelevant.

                            So why are we paying tax dollars for a piece of paper that is irrelevant for the people who take it? Because, again, as you said in Carly's case, the fact that she got an undergrad in Philosophy has absolutely no bearing on her abilities in real life.

                            Why are we paying for that? What is the usefulness of that field in modern, public universities?

                            Those are the key issues that you, Aggie, and nostromo have done your damnest to avoid, but it's pretty unavoidable now. That's why you've resorted to nothing but insults and "you just don't understand".

                            This argument is over, and you weren't on the winning side.
                            "The issue is there are still many people out there that use religion as a crutch for bigotry and hate. Like Ben."
                            Ben Kenobi: "That means I'm doing something right. "

                            Comment


                            • The purpose of university, of education in general is not simply to make you able to write a computer program that will organize the sewage system of a city. It is also, maybe much more importantly, meant to give you a paideia. Theoretical studies are much better at doing this than those that simply teach you how to operate a machine or do a logistics account. You can see that in everyday life.

                              Comment


                              • Originally posted by Bereta_Eder
                                The purpose of university, of education in general is not simply to make you able to write a computer program that will organize the sewage system of a city. It is also, maybe much more importantly, meant to give you a paideia. Theoretical studies are much better at doing this than those that simply teach you how to operate a machine or do a logistics account. You can see that in everyday life.
                                A nice high-level overview that escapes the issue again.

                                We've already addressed that universities are not technical institutions.

                                What the pro-Philosophy in public university side has not been able to address is why Philosophy, specifically, is still needed in today's public universities.

                                All of the useful parts of Philosophy splinter off into specialty fields.
                                "The issue is there are still many people out there that use religion as a crutch for bigotry and hate. Like Ben."
                                Ben Kenobi: "That means I'm doing something right. "

                                Comment

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