Power nazis in Bulgaria

[Atahualpa]

Originally posted by Datajack Franit
By the fact that not building a nuclear power plant means using other kind of power plants aka coal/gas

Hydropower? Solar power?

I think before we get reasonable fusion power plants we might end up making solar panels in space and beam the power down to collector stations on earth. Sounds futuristic, but i think this is possible.

[Az]

Solar power?

[Atahualpa]

Originally posted by Sir Og
Never heard of her. Nor about the death threats.
And Bulgaria is definately not in "desperate need for energy and clean water". Our majour industries are not working now as they used to 15 years ago and the country actually exports energy to Turkey and Romania.
There is only debate where to buy the reactor from. Russia or Canada.

She was a member of the green party once. I don't know why you never heard of her, I thought she did quite a large campaign around Belen.
The death threats are for real though and I think there have already been (unsuccessful) attempts like being "accidentally" hit by a car.

[Atahualpa]

Originally posted by Az

Solar power?

[KrazyHorse]

Originally posted by Atahualpa

[Atahualpa]

[Sir Og]

I did some search on Albena and the death threat story and it seems that it is not picked up by any of the majour media here (our media is as free as they come). I can not say that she is making this up but there is no debate whether to have Belene or not around here and I see no reason whatsoever about such threats. It doesn't make sense to threaten someone who nobody has even heard about. She was not a leader of the green party and the party itself was only big at the start of the political changes here.
The only debate in Bulgaria about the Belene powerplant is if we need the extra capacity right now (at the moment Bulgaria exports energy) and where to get the reactors from (Russia or Canada).
The construction began in the 80s but after the economy collapsed it was halted. So now we have nuclear powerplant that is 1/3 built and it only makes sense to complete the work and not just waste what is already done.
The people from Belene would probably like to see the power plant open ASAP because of the jobs.

[snoopy369]

Originally posted by Atahualpa


Hydropower? Solar power?

I think before we get reasonable fusion power plants we might end up making solar panels in space and beam the power down to collector stations on earth. Sounds futuristic, but i think this is possible.

That's all the proof I need that you're not entirely being realistic here.

Beaming power down will NEVER work. It would cost far, far more energy to keep the beaming-satellites going than you'd gain ... and any minor fluctuations would be ... not friendly. Besides, think of the eco-damage you'd probably cause ...

Solar energy is unrealistic due to its low current and high fluctuations. Perhaps if we could coat the Sahara with silicon ... but no.

Hydropower is not something most environmentalists are in favor of. It destroys the ecology of the river that is dammed, which is far more damage than nuclear power is going to cause.

In the scheme of things, Nuclear Power is the safest and most ecologically friendly of the power supplies that is realistic given our power demands and current technology. Perhaps power-from-space is feasible some day - but likely in the form of stored energy, not beamed. At least not as far as we currently can imagine it technologically ...

However, if you want to talk about eco-friendly mining IN SPACE, I'll give you that one and raise you a few carbon-containing asteroids

[Sikander]

Originally posted by Atahualpa


Hydropower? Solar power?

I think before we get reasonable fusion power plants we might end up making solar panels in space and beam the power down to collector stations on earth. Sounds futuristic, but i think this is possible.

Hydropower does a lot of damage to riparian ecosystems and in any case is quite limited to certain locales and in the amount of energy it can produce, as well as the timeliness of the energy it can produce. Solar power doesn't compete well for cost, and suffers hugely from timeliness problems (night, weather, time of year). More efficient means of storing energy would reduce the timeliness problems of course, but even with 100% efficiency solar is simply too expensive for the production of mass amounts of energy with today's technology. As for the orbital solar energy scheme, it requires a lot more tech improvements than regular solar does and would be extremely expensive. I seriously doubt that it will ever be done no matter how advanced our technology, as there would IMO be better alternatives.

[Atahualpa]

Well, I don't really think big in Solar plants. It's a different technology that requires different handling, big plants are not what I think is adequate here.
Or maybe if you have a big plant and some mirrors in space that can project and focus the light down on earth, maybe, but that's another project...

I think for example there are lots of households and every household has a roof and most households need most energy from 10-12am (at least here) when the cooking starts. At this time the sun is usually shining and having equipped most households with solar panels could help cut the spikes.
That way you need less importing and the need for reservoir plants is going down as well.

That's all the proof I need that you're not entirely being realistic here.

Beaming power down will NEVER work. It would cost far, far more energy to keep the beaming-satellites going than you'd gain ... and any minor fluctuations would be ... not friendly. Besides, think of the eco-damage you'd probably cause ...

And humans can _never_ fly...

I did some search on Albena and the death threat story and it seems that it is not picked up by any of the majour media here (our media is as free as they come). I can not say that she is making this up but there is no debate whether to have Belene or not around here and I see no reason whatsoever about such threats. It doesn't make sense to threaten someone who nobody has even heard about. She was not a leader of the green party and the party itself was only big at the start of the political changes here.

Yes, I said member of the green party, because that's what I've read in one article about her once.
Too bad you never heard of her, I mean probably it has become more silent around her, but she also received the goldman prize in 1996. She must have at least been mentioned then. (edited)

Goldman Prize:

The Goldman Environmental Prize is a prize given annually to grassroots environmental activists from six geographic areas: Africa, Asia, Europe, Islands and Island Nations, North America, and South and Central America. The prize includes a no-strings-attached award of $125,000. It is the most lucrative such award.

The Goldman Environmental Prize was created in 1990 by civic leaders and philanthropists Richard N. Goldman and his late wife, Rhoda H. Goldman. Richard Goldman founded Goldman Insurance Services in San Francisco. Rhoda Goldman was a descendant of Levi Strauss, founder of the worldwide clothing company.

The Goldman Environmental Prize winners are selected by an international jury from confidential nominations submitted by a worldwide network of environmental organizations and individuals. Prize winners participate in a 10-day tour of San Francisco and Washington, D.C., for an awards ceremony and presentation, news conferences, media briefings and meetings with political, public policy, financial and environmental leaders.

The only debate in Bulgaria about the Belene powerplant is if we need the extra capacity right now (at the moment Bulgaria exports energy) and where to get the reactors from (Russia or Canada).
The construction began in the 80s but after the economy collapsed it was halted. So now we have nuclear powerplant that is 1/3 built and it only makes sense to complete the work and not just waste what is already done.
The people from Belene would probably like to see the power plant open ASAP because of the jobs.

Well we here in Austria have a fully functional nuclear plant that was NEVER activated. Politicians built it in the 70s and then people raised concern and there was a vote ('78) about having it activated. It was abandoned by a minor margin of 50.47%

[Az]

Well we here in Austria have a fully functional nuclear plant that was NEVER activated. Politicians built it in the 70s and then people raised concern and there was a vote ('78) about having it activated. It was abandoned by a minor margin of 50.47%

My god, what a waste of human labor and capital.

[Atahualpa]

Well you know as a member of the 10 richest countries in the world (gdp per capita)...
I think we can afford it

[Az]

Oooh, great reasoning.

I guess the US is one of the riches countries of the world too, in per capita GDP, and is the richest in total GDP. that 400< Billion $ defence budget is an awesome idea.


Actually, it's a better idea than the non-working nuke plant. The former is actually useful.

[Atahualpa]

Seriously I think the descision to not activate it is okay. Even if it was a waste, just "because it's there" is no reason to use it. At least not for me.

[Az]

No, the "electricity need" is a reason to use it. The "it's there" is a huge layer of cream on the cake.