Alberta: The New Ontario

[Last Conformist]

25% of Canada's economy isn't anywhere near a global economic goliath. Try 250% of Canada's economy.

[Asher]

Originally posted by Last Conformist
25% of Canada's economy isn't anywhere near a global economic goliath. Try 250% of Canada's economy.

I'll grant it's an exaggeration, but look what Alberta has done in the past 30 years.

It's perhaps the fastest growing, most properous region in the world. And its growth is showing no signs of slowing, in fact the opposite is true...

In terms of the energy market, it's absolutely huge these days. It's like Saudi Arabia, but without the whole middle east nonsense.

[Flubber]

The "problem" will be somewhat self-correcting. More people should go into trades seeing the opportunity and its likely that more people will move to Alberta for the economic opportunity. That will bring

1. people from all over with diverse political beliefs
2. some additional power for Alberta as should garner a greater proportion of electoral seats

The problem though is Alberta is still "small" in population compared to Quebec and Ontario so that evolutionary adjustment of numbers of MPs will not change some feelings that Ontario and Quebec control the country

[Asher]

http://www.saturdaynight.ca/feature/article.cfm?listing_id=64

The New Ontario: Corridor Of Power
By Andrew Nikiforuk


IN THE 1800s aboriginals called it the Wolf ’s Track, and you’d have been hard-pressed to find anyone on it. Today the Edmonton-Calgary corridor is one of the fastest-growing regions in the world and boasts a population of nearly 2.5 million souls, more than Manitoba and Saskatchewan combined. Every day 50,000 vehicles use the four-lane divided thoroughfare known as Highway 2. Once flanked by vast prairie expanses that on a clear day still offer scenic glimpses of the Rocky Mountains, the corridor now sports jarring colonies of constant residential development and classic nowhere architecture.

Dubbed the “Western Tiger” by the TD Bank Financial Group, the corridor connects Edmonton, a sprawling metropolis serving the oil sands, to Calgary, a sprawling metropolis answering the continent’s insatiable appetite for natural gas. In between lie more growing concerns such as Red Deer, an agriculture and oilpatch centre dominated by evangelical churches that serves as a trading area for nearly two million people. A land of new subdivisions, sleek SUVs and cellphone-armed engineers and dealmakers, the region’s commercial heart — try $105 billion in related investments — furiously outpaces southern Ontario’s. Its standard of living is actually closer to that of the Grand Duchy of Luxembourg, the wealthiest nation on earth.

It has also developed growing pains. Manure from factory farms around Red Deer threatens local groundwater as well as the sanity of down-winders. Subdivisions are sprawling so quickly over the prairie that oil and gas drillers collide daily with municipal planners and housing developers. So many new cottages have been planned for Sylvan Lake, a poor man’s Muskoka, that the water body won’t be able to handle its projected flotilla of 400 boats. The oilpatch now plans to drill more than 50,000 coal bed methane wells on prime corridor farmland; the region could theoretically end up supporting 12 times that number. In Calgary, concentric rings of monster-sized homes continue to creep toward the foothills so determinedly that the scenic drive to Banff may soon be obliterated. A recent proposal to drill sour-gas wells on the edge of the city immediately placed 250,000 citizens in an “emergency planning zone,” a controversial designation usually found around nuclear power plants.

According to Calgary’s smiling Mayor Dave Bronconnier, whom everyone calls Bronco, “there is no such thing as urban sprawl in Calgary.” The numbers, however, show a city with a vastly expanding waistline. Since 1970 the population has more than doubled. A road network of 2,800 kilometres has become a clogged maze of 12,000. In terms of square kilometres, Calgary now has the same size footprint as New York — but with only one-tenth of the people. “Calgary is a centrifugal force spinning out,” says Bev Sandalack, a local urban designer. In this unrestrained spin, farmland and mountain vistas are disappearing. “It’s unsustainable and unethical” to Sandalack, but in this place, with no immediate natural constraints — such as a great lake — to force greater population density, the end of suburbia is nowhere in sight.

The entire region is slowly discovering a Wallace Stegner truth: “Water is the true wealth in a dry land.” Receding glaciers mean Calgary may well experience severe late-summer water shortages by 2030. The Red Deer River,which runs through the middle of Alberta’s miraculous corridor, is fully allocated. The thirst of factory farms, oil wells and municipal growth has led to the depletion of groundwater in the corridor, forcing many communities to build multimillion-dollar water pipelines. Visitors from places familiar with the meaning of the word aridity can’t believe the state of growth and drying here. Henry Vaux Jr., a Berkeley economist, recently observed that groundwater depletion in Asia could leave 150 million Chinese high and dry in 20 years. “It blows my mind,” he says, “that we are creating the same circumstances here.” No matter. Growth never looks forward or back, even as it consumes promised lands.

[Flubber]

Originally posted by Last Conformist
25% of Canada's economy isn't anywhere near a global economic goliath. Try 250% of Canada's economy.

Agreed

China and the US are world economic goliaths.

Alberta is a very powerful but small economic engine

[Flubber]

Originally posted by Asher
It's perhaps the fastest growing, most properous region in the world. And its growth is showing no signs of slowing, in fact the opposite is true...

I doubt Alberta is either the "fastest growing" or "most prosperous" regions in the world . ( I guess it would depend how you measure things??)

Don't get me wrong , Alberta is doing very very well but the fastest growing places are probably starting from a very low base level wgile the most prosperous include likely oil shiekdoms, European City-states and probably chunks of some US states (I'm thinking the opulence of Beverly Hills or Miami Beach here)

[Max Webster]

If Alberta got such in such a bad way by fault of other provinces. Then what is with your original post where Alberta is flourishing and going to be the next Ontario. Gee Alberta should be still so poor and down and out. BooHoo I'm going shed a tear now I think for poor Alberta. All those people live in those lush houses around Calgary, oh my they must be starving. We should have a live8 for them.

Still like my spoiled whiny brat analogy. Its very fitting.



Seriously. Hey Asher if Alberta is doing very well. Than thats just wonderful by me. Sorry to hear to the Federal goverment srewed you around. I wasn't involved in the procedure personally so don't blame me. But you have my permission to go kick Ottawa in the nuts if makes you feel any better. But anyway I think every province should do well. I wish them all the best.


Go CANADA Go

[Flubber]

Originally posted by Max Webster
. Sorry to hear to the Federal goverment srewed you around. I wasn't involved in the procedure personally so don't blame me. But you have my permission to go kick Ottawa in the nuts if makes you feel any better. But anyway I think every province should do well. I wish them all the best.


Go CANADA Go

Well to this day, people blame the National Energy Program for stifling a growing industry. It certainly contributed to a huge crushing "bust" at a time when Alberta was gearing up for a "boom".

Personally I didn't work in the industry or live in Alberta then so I just see Albertas doing well now and am satisfied to forget about it. I just don't think the feds could get away with trying it again. (Alberta would go ballistic as would the US to the extent any of their supply were threatened)

[Max Webster]

Flubber, you seem like an intelligent rational person with no bias towards Alberta. Just what did happen with our goverment and Alberta. What are this details of this NEP that Albertans loathe. And is it true that Quebec and Ontario screwed Alberta?

Personally I think Alberta should share in its wealth with the rest of Canada. I think every province should do this. But not to the detriment of the province sharing.

If Ottawa was unfair towards Alberta than I truly feel for Alberta.

[Max Webster]

Sorry I didn't your see last post. You answered some of my questions. Frpm what I read of your post I do get the impression that Albertans do have a right to be angry. Maybe the goverment should waited till after the boom. And then asked the Albertans politely if we could have a little bit of your wealth to help other less fortunate Canadians.

Why do Albertans have such a pickle up their butt over Quebec. I know they are an annoying whiny bunch that just want to be different for the sake of being different. But their is got to be more to it.

[Asher]

Originally posted by Max Webster
If Alberta got such in such a bad way by fault of other provinces. Then what is with your original post where Alberta is flourishing and going to be the next Ontario. Gee Alberta should be still so poor and down and out. BooHoo I'm going shed a tear now I think for poor Alberta. All those people live in those lush houses around Calgary, oh my they must be starving. We should have a live8 for them.

Still like my spoiled whiny brat analogy. Its very fitting.

Actually, you should look up the NEP and see how real this actually was. The Liberal government in the early 80s were gutting Alberta for all it was worth, crashed its economy, all for the benefit of the people out east...

It wasn't until the conservatives came into power that they got rid of the NEP and restored Alberta's economy.

[Asher]

And it's whackos like this from out east who don't even understand the industry that were the cause of the problem. Posted April 2nd, 2005:

http://w-3productions.com/weblog/archives/2005/04/remember_the_na.html

Remember the National Energy Program? It's Time Now For A New One.

Progressive Politics Editorial

The much maligned NEP was put into place by the Trudeau government during the oil crisis of the '70's. With oil prices rising astronomically (for the time) Canadians demanded action. The answer was the NEP and Canada began providing oil and gas to Canadians at lower prices following the idea that these resources belonged to all Canadians and we should all share in this public resource.

The oil corporations hated the NEP and when they got their political hacks, the Mulroney government elected, Brian did his duty and eliminated the NEP. Canada's oil prices were now no longer going to bring direct benefit to Canadians, but rather were set at the world oil price. This was all happening hand in hand with a rightwing shift towards the neo-liberal agenda of privatization, deregulation and globalization. The "market" was the answer to all our needs and this free market would somehow provide all of us with prosperity. This and the tooth fairy along with $1.00 will buy you a liter of gasoline today.

So as we watch consumers in places like Saudi Arabia pay $.25 for a gallon of gas - what the heck it's their oil under their sand - we're tied into this neo-con con job and paying $1.00 a liter.

We have to wonder when the Canadian working class is going to start to wake up to the fact that they've been following the wrong pipers for far too long. These sleazy politicians who set government policy do not work in the public interest and never have. They are bought and paid for by the huge corporations who plunder the resources of this planet in their endless lust for more and more and more. Their ability to dumb down the working class, who make up the majority of the population, is legendary. Through sophisticated means of media control they're able to keep us working against our own interests and in the interests of the rich and powerful.

While we dolts sit around arguing about whether a brain-dead Florida women wanted or didn't want to die, the corporations and their lackeys have more important things on their minds and that is looking for more and more ways to screw us dumb folks and make us think they're doing us a favour.

But reality does have a way in helping to remove the blinkers. The Great Depression produced an open-eyed new class conscious generation of workers that when they came back from WWII, demanded unions, healthcare, unemployment insurance, old age pensions and a greater part of the economic pie that their labours produced. The present generation is also going to have to smarten up. The rising cost of energy, that will have its repercussions throughout our economy and most certainly in the economic wellbeing of Canada's working class should start to open some eyes.

Now is the time now to call for a new NEP for Canada and Ralph Klein be damned. It's once again time to give very serious consideration to privatizing the resources that belong to all Canadians, including the working class and make those resources available to Canadians not at world prices, but at prices that reflect the fact that we own those resources.

The funniest part of all is this left-wing nut is saying Saudi Arabia pays a lot less for gas because it's all under their sand...most gas isn't refined in Saudi Arabia, and the reason their gas costs less is they don't have any tax on it...the left-wing governments in Canada keep adding more and more tax on the gas, increasing the cost.

[Max Webster]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Energy_Program

Your right. Good ole mulroney kicked it out the door.

According to that link it says it was brought on by the energy crisis in the 70's. Ottawa wanted a reliable source of oil in their own country, Alberta has that oil. It also says that Albertans didn't like it because they were stripping Alberta of its natural resourse. Funny Flubber says the oils sands are going to triple their production in 2015. So seems to me that their is plenty left to go around. So the stripping part seems far fetched.
Now where can I find information about the effects of the NEP on the Albertan economy.

You people realize how much crap google brings up when I enter NEP or National Energy Program.

Gawd.. this is like being at work.

[Asher]

The National Energy Program

The Queen with Mr. & Mrs. LougheedThe National Energy Program (NEP) was introduced on October 28, 1980 by the Honourable Marc Lalonde. The NEP sought to increase both Canadian control and Canadian ownership of the energy industry. It also sought to protect all Canadians from surging oil prices. The federal government would accomplish their goals through measures such as price controls and federal taxes on oil and gas production. These measures would increase federal government control in the oil and gas industry.

Many Albertans were upset over the NEP for several reasons. First, they perceived the NEP as an intrusion on their provincial rights since control of natural resources falls under provincial jurisdiction. Second, some Albertans felt that the NEP was passed to benefit Alberta's natural resourcescentral Canada, particularly Ottawa. Many argued that Alberta lost a tremendous amount of money due to the NEP. These figures differ from scholar to scholar and range from $50 to $100 billion dollars. Third, Albertans were angered by the NEP due to the fact that a significant number of oil companies left the province of Alberta, leaving many Albertans unemployed. Some Albertans showed their disapproval by sporting bumper stickers that stated "Let the eastern bastards freeze in the dark." Premier Peter Lougheed's planned actions against the federal government and central Canada included cutting oil production.

To this day, the National Energy Program is a sore spot with many Albertans. The NEP is often cited as an example of federal government discrimination, which increased feelings of western alienation and led to the creation of many western separatist groups. Premier Peter Lougheed will be forever remembered for his tremendous leadership during this period of Alberta's history.

[Asher]

Originally posted by Max Webster
Your right. Good ole mulroney kicked it out the door.

According to that link it says it was brought on by the energy crisis in the 70's. Ottawa wanted a reliable source of oil in their own country, Alberta has that oil. It also says that Albertans didn't like it because they were stripping Alberta of its natural resourse. Funny Flubber says the oils sands are going to triple their production in 2015. So seems to me that their is plenty left to go around. So the stripping part seems far fetched.
Now where can I find information about the effects of the NEP on the Albertan economy.

You people realize how much crap google brings up when I enter NEP or National Energy Program.

Gawd.. this is like being at work.

There's way more to it than that -- the "stripping" part refers to control over it. The provinces own the natural resources under the ground, not the federal government. As such, the NEP is overreaching their boundaries.

They wanted to nationalize the industry -- it forced the American investors out (who made the VAST majority of the investors) in favour of Canadian companies, such as Petro-Canada. When the American companies started leaving, unemployment skyrocketed. When less people were employed, the whole economy began to tank -- the whole economy was based on energy during the early 80s. All of the jobs eventually connected back to energy jobs, and with those being eliminated the province went into a depression.

At the same time, it also forced oil to be sold WELL under market price in Canada.

Why was this done? Trudeau and the Liberal party thought oil cost too much, and since we have oil, why not just nationalize it and have Canadians working on it, for Canadians. What a brilliant idea for a modern economy, especially one founded on and based off foreign investment.