Bustin' on the Jesus Freaks...

[JohnT]

So, today, my wife, Sophie, and I went out to lunch at one of our fine Chili's establishments. While we were there, we saw the most asinine and stupid thing possible - a couple of women were wearing "Incredibles" t-shirts with a "J" replacing the "I", and the words "Farrugut Church of Christ" stenciled around the logo. I mean, there was no doubt - the shirt was the same color red, the logo had the same coloring, they even made the "J" with the same shading gradient as the original "I" (Check out http://www.imdb.com/gallery/ss/0317705/TI-002.jpg if you don't know what I mean.)

Not being a fan of zealots, and not believing that these people would actually "steal for Jesus", plus seeing a chance to irritate

a. anti-copyright zealots
b. Christians (meaning all of Knoxville)

I turned them in.

Following is the text of the email I wrote to the Disney Legal Department and Pixar Animation:

Madam/Sir:

I would like to report a possible copyright violation in regards to the use of the Incredibles logo.

The Farragut Church of Christ (http://www.farragutchurch.org/) has printed and distributed a number of special-made "Incredibles"-esque T-shirts. I found this out when two church members wore them today: my wife and I saw them during lunch.

The logo design on the front of the shirts follow the original logo almost exactly - same color orange/yellow/black with the same shading. The shirt itself is... "Incredibles red" (for want of a better term: my daughter has an official shirt we bought at the Disney Store and the copies were the same shade of red.) I said "almost exactly" in regards to the logo design as the only difference between the official logo and the one the church is distributing that the lower-case "I" was replaced with a lower-case "J" (for Jesus.) Also, surrounding the logo, the words "Farragut Church of Christ" were stenciled in white. On the back of the shirts are more Incredibles references, but I didn't get as good a look at the back as I did the front.

Not wanting to start an argument in a public place, in front of my three year-old, I didn't ask them if they asked/received permission or whatever - that's your job. However, it was quite offensive to see an actual *church* "stealing for Jesus" - if that's what they were doing. For all I know, they did receive permission to use the logo in the manner in which they did... but I doubt it.

I do note that the church did bother to copyright their website, so *somebody* there is sensitive to the issue - at least in how it affects Farragut Church of Christ.

Not knowing who actually holds the copyright for the logo, I am sending this to both Pixar and Disney. One suggestion if I may - please make it simpler to actually report violations: I saw nothing on the Pixar site about this and on the Disney site I had to click my way through to http://corporate.disney.go.com/corpo...ndards24.html, call the 818 number listed, and only then, from a *phone call*, did I get the tips@disneyantipiracy.com address.

Thank you. If you need to contact me, please reach me via this email address. I have no affiliation with the church and have no idea as to how to get one of these shirts, but I will be glad to answer any questions you might have.

John T
Knoxville, TN

PS: The church's address and phone number follows:
...

The back of these shirts were eye-rolling. "Jesus - the ONLY superhero" was stenciled in large letters along with biblical characters in Incredibles-like poses ( http://www.imdb.com/gallery/ss/0317705/TI-026.jpg ) (which, dammit, I forgot to mention in the letter) and Bible verses.

Having read some of the horror stories about people who run counter to the desires of the Disney Legal Department, I'm just rubbing my hands together with anticipatory glee. If Disney goes after these people, it'll likely make the evening news, meaning that the next time Christians want to steal for Jesus they'll think again. See? I'm just a force for 'round these parts: too bad they'll never look at it that way.

[Wiglaf]

Uhh Fair use.

I have no affiliation with the church and have no idea as to how to get one of these shirts,

It's a church, therefore it is fair use (they are not selling them). Farragut

[Kuciwalker]

Re: Bustin' on the Jesus Freaks...

Originally posted by JohnT
Having read some of the horror stories about people who run counter to the desires of the Disney Legal Department, I'm just rubbing my hands together with anticipatory glee. If Disney goes after these people, it'll likely make the evening news, meaning that the next time Christians want to steal for Jesus they'll think again. See? I'm just a force for 'round these parts: too bad they'll never look at it that way.

You are an evil, incredibly awesome, person

[Koyaanisqatsi]

Originally posted by Wiglaf
It's a church, therefore it is fair use (they are not selling them). Farragut

Um. No.

[DRoseDARs]

@ JohnT's actions

[JohnT]

Not really.

Wrong. Fair use is one of the most abused concepts of copyrights. Fair use allows you to use excerpts for journalistic review or educational inclusion. It is generally considered valid in educational or journalistic settings, generally not so in a "for profit" setting.

Fair use does not allow you to take a drawn image and scan it, then post it on a web site. That is a violation of the creator's right to reproduce. Nor does it allow you to create an image of another's copyrighted character for "public use." That is a violation of their right of derivative work. Neither can you make a scan of an image (or large excerpt from a literary work) for use as advertising - this violates at least 3 of the creator's rights. Unless you are using it in an educational or journalistic manner, be very careful about using "Fair Use" as an excuse to violate someone's copyright. There are very limited uses outside of educational or journalistic endeavors.

A major copy company recently was severely fined for attempting to classify the wholesale lifting of material for publication for ultimate use on college campuses as "Fair Use." While the initial violations were by the many teachers & professors that used the copy company to make their class readers (without getting permission from the copyright holders initially), it was ruled that since the copy company knew the rules and did it anyway, they were held responsible. It could be argued that it was for educational use, but it was not excerpts, it was whole articles, and it was in a "for profit" manner.

The use doesn't match the "Fair Use" criteria as it wasn't journalistic, educational, and was used to specifically advertise the church (hence the stencil around the "Incredibles" logo.)

[Wiglaf]

It's legal for me to buy a Nike shirt and put WIGLAF NIKE and wear it at Chili's. It's called fair use.

[Jonny]

Less Jesus Freaks in TN

[JohnT]

Only if Nike specifically allows that purpose. If "Wiglaf" is an advertisement for "Wiglaf" services ( ), then it doesn't fall under the Fair Use clause/doctrine/whatever.

[Wiglaf]

Originally posted by JohnT
Only if Nike specifically allows that purpose. If "Wiglaf" is an advertisement for "Wiglaf" services ( ), then it doesn't fall under the Fair Use clause/doctrine/whatever.

You're right However this particular service is a house of god. Perhaps an infringement occured, but there are no damages done here (no profit gained/lost) except perhaps to Satan, which takes the teeth out of Disney's legal argument.

[Imran Siddiqui]

JohnT is right. It ain't fair use to copy a logo for use to advertise a Church.

JohnT

[loinburger]

[Last Conformist]

Originally posted by JohnT If "Wiglaf" is an advertisement for "Wiglaf" services ( )

I hear they're very popular with the online gay community.

JohnT

[JohnT]

Originally posted by Wiglaf


You're right However this particular service is a house of god. Perhaps an infringement occured, but there are no damages done here (no profit gained/lost) except perhaps to Satan, which takes the teeth out of Disney's legal argument.

There's damage done to my sensibilities and good taste. I also don't want my daughter exposed to those sort of people, and anything they do that would attract her (Sophie is a big Incredibles fan) which I can stop is a good thing indeed.

[Kuciwalker]

There's also damage done to Disney's image. Who would want to be associated with these people?