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  • Another ethical question

    Today I saw the movie: SAW which honestly is quite a dull piece except in some parts. Overall I was dissapointed by the lack of depth and the end... well.

    Anyway, the movie poses 2 slightly different ethical questions. Let's start with the situations.

    Situation A:
    You are locked in a room. You have a device on your head that will kill you in 15 minutes. The device is locked and the key is in the stomach of a man, alive and awake, who is lying on the floor, but who cannot move because of some strong tranquilizers (whose effects will not diminish over the next 15 minutes). You have a knife. A video presents you what will happen if you don't open the lock with the key in 15 minutes (your mouth will be torn apart and your head explode).

    Modification of A: You will need to obtain 2 (or more) keys and kill 2 (or more) tranqulized persons on the floor. Do you do it?


    Situation B:
    You are again locked into a room and your foot is chained to the wall. This time you have a gun with a single shot and a poisened cigarette. The objective is to kill the other person in the room (that you don't know), who is chained to the wall with the feet as well, before some time is over. You can either shoot him or trick him into smoking the cigarette. Otherwise the guy observing the room through a video camera is going to kill your (wife|husband) and your child. You have spoken to them through a phone (that can only receive calls). You cannot destroy the camera.

    Modification of B: You need to kill 2 or more people to save your loved ones.


    So in both situations what is ethical to do? Is it okay to kill someone (or more) to save yourself? Is it okay to kill someone (or more) to save others (that you love)?


    As for me, I probably could not kill someone (innocent) to save myself and I could probably not kill someone (innocent) to save someone else. Above all I would have too much doubt that the told outcome is really going to happen or that the promise to not kill my loved ones is really to be held. Effectively, my doubts would paralyze me.

    What would be the ethical thing to do? What would you do?

  • #2
    This is the same "stupid" question that pops up in my country every now and than. "What would you have done if you were alive during WW2? Being in the resistance, being a collaborator or just do nothing, trying to go with the flow?" IOW, no one can give a real answer without being in such a situation.
    Within weeks they'll be re-opening the shipyards
    And notifying the next of kin
    Once again...

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    • #3
      Stick your fingers down the dude's throat and force him to vomit up the keys. Duh.
      12-17-10 Mohamed Bouazizi NEVER FORGET
      Stadtluft Macht Frei
      Killing it is the new killing it
      Ultima Ratio Regum

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      • #4

        Situation A:
        You are locked in a room. You have a device on your head that will kill you in 15 minutes. The device is locked and the key is in the stomach of a man, alive and awake, who is lying on the floor, but who cannot move because of some strong tranquilizers (whose effects will not diminish over the next 15 minutes). You have a knife. A video presents you what will happen if you don't open the lock with the key in 15 minutes (your mouth will be torn apart and your head explode).

        Modification of A: You will need to obtain 2 (or more) keys and kill 2 (or more) tranqulized persons on the floor. Do you do it?


        A: Yes.

        Modification: No, unless the guys are going to die anyway.

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        • #5
          Originally posted by KrazyHorse
          Stick your fingers down the dude's throat and force him to vomit up the keys. Duh.
          One reason why the movie was crap.
          But okay, just assume you can't get the key without killing him...

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          • #6
            Originally posted by Kuciwalker
            Modification: No, unless the guys are going to die anyway.
            You don't know that, you are only being told that they have the keys and you have to kill them all to be freed. Wether or not they die later, is unknown to you.
            I guess you'll stay with a "no" then?

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            • #7
              The questions are only ethically challanging if you assume the dust that calls itself people matter to me.
              Exult in your existence, because that very process has blundered unwittingly on its own negation. Only a small, local negation, to be sure: only one species, and only a minority of that species; but there lies hope. [...] Stand tall, Bipedal Ape. The shark may outswim you, the cheetah outrun you, the swift outfly you, the capuchin outclimb you, the elephant outpower you, the redwood outlast you. But you have the biggest gifts of all: the gift of understanding the ruthlessly cruel process that gave us all existence [and the] gift of revulsion against its implications.
              -Richard Dawkins

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              • #8
                Originally posted by Atahualpa
                You don't know that, you are only being told that they have the keys and you have to kill them all to be freed. Wether or not they die later, is unknown to you.
                I guess you'll stay with a "no" then?
                Yes.

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                • #9
                  if it's them or me (however many there are) then that's bad luck for them, cos i'm gonna survive.
                  "The Christian way has not been tried and found wanting, it has been found to be hard and left untried" - GK Chesterton.

                  "The most obvious predicition about the future is that it will be mostly like the past" - Alain de Botton

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                  • #10
                    And what if the Device was actually fake and you did the dirty work, being used and manipulated by someone else?
                    This possibility is not worrying you?

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                    • #11
                      ask a silly question...

                      and what if a magic unicorn flys through the wall and saves both of us, eh?
                      "The Christian way has not been tried and found wanting, it has been found to be hard and left untried" - GK Chesterton.

                      "The most obvious predicition about the future is that it will be mostly like the past" - Alain de Botton

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                      • #12
                        if the magic unicorns are meant to be police officers.. well yes it's a possibility

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                        • #13
                          What if I have Jedi powers and can disarm the device with the Force?

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                          • #14

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                            • #15
                              Originally posted by Kuciwalker
                              What if I have Jedi powers and can disarm the device with the Force?
                              Just disarm the device first, and then kill the guy while rambling about the power of the dark side
                              The enemy cannot push a button if you disable his hand.

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