China is teh evil, OMFG!111!@

[Agathon]

Re: Re: China is teh evil, OMFG!111!@

Originally posted by MichaeltheGreat

China is a nascent superpower with global influence.

I'll grant you that, and I'll grant you that they do bad ****. But apart from a few regional disputes that have a long history, where is the evidence that China plans to act in the way that Britain, France and the United States acted when they were superpowers?

[Joseph]

Re: Re: Re: China is teh evil, OMFG!111!@

Originally posted by Agathon


I'll grant you that, and I'll grant you that they do bad ****. But apart from a few regional disputes that have a long history, where is the evidence that China plans to act in the way that Britain, France and the United States acted when they were superpowers?

Their military growth over the last few years. Why do they need it, no one is going to invade new week.

[MichaeltheGreat]

Re: Re: Re: China is teh evil, OMFG!111!@

Originally posted by Agathon


I'll grant you that, and I'll grant you that they do bad ****. But apart from a few regional disputes that have a long history, where is the evidence that China plans to act in the way that Britain, France and the United States acted when they were superpowers?

They had "regional disputes" because they lacked the force project capabilities to have global disputes.

[Agathon]

Re: Re: Re: Re: China is teh evil, OMFG!111!@

Originally posted by Joseph
Their military growth over the last few years. Why do they need it, no one is going to invade new week.

I thought the answer would be obvious: the continuing belligerent attitude of the United States.

Why does the United States need such a ridiculously large military? It's not as if they do anything useful with it other than piss people off.

[Agathon]

Re: Re: Re: Re: China is teh evil, OMFG!111!@

Originally posted by MichaeltheGreat


They had "regional disputes" because they lacked the force project capabilities to have global disputes.

That's not a real answer. Where is the evidence that they actually have such ambitions. Old Adolf wrote a book telling everyone what he wanted. Where is the real evidence that goes beyond paranoid speculation?

[MichaeltheGreat]

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: China is teh evil, OMFG!111!@

Originally posted by Agathon


That's not a real answer. Where is the evidence that they actually have such ambitions. Old Adolf wrote a book telling everyone what he wanted. Where is the real evidence that goes beyond paranoid speculation?

Yes, they just wish peace and global brotherhood for all!

[Last Conformist]

The Chinese being humans, the burden of proof rests on those who assert that they won't act like total bastards.

[Agathon]

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: China is teh evil, OMFG!111!@

Originally posted by MichaeltheGreat


Yes, they just wish peace and global brotherhood for all!

Where is the evidence?

[Kuciwalker]

The fact that they're human?

The burden of proof is on you to demonstrate that somehow they're different.

[Dinner]

Re: Re: Re: Re: China is teh evil, OMFG!111!@

Originally posted by Joseph
Their military growth over the last few years. Why do they need it, no one is going to invade new week.

Primarially the vast increases in military spending are because the CCP wants to be king **** in the east Asian sandbox. They want to be able to pick a fight with Taiwan and win, they want to be able to pick a fight over the Spratleys and win, and to over a dozen other territorial disputes. They also don't like playing second fiddle to Japan and it would be nice to brow beat South Korea or Vietnam if additional disputes arise with those powers or if the border dispute between Indian & China once again flairs into war like it has done in the past.

Then we have China's national inferiority complex and their national obsession with compensating for it.

[MichaeltheGreat]

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: China is teh evil, OMFG!111!@

Originally posted by Agathon


Where is the evidence?

Just because they aren't stupid enough to proclaim their intentions doesn't mean they lack intention. Evidence isn't needed, the simple fact is that there is only room for one superpower, and we're it.

Besides, read Sun Tzu. The goal is to **** them before they have the ability to do anything, not to wait around until after they've carried out whatever their intentions are.

[Lonestar]

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: China is teh evil, OMFG!111!@

Originally posted by Agathon


That's not a real answer. Where is the evidence that they actually have such ambitions. Old Adolf wrote a book telling everyone what he wanted. Where is the real evidence that goes beyond paranoid speculation?

OH! I know! I know!

China up until recently wasn't dependant on outside natural resources to maintain it's increasing standard of living?

[Agathon]

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: China is teh evil, OMFG!111!@

Originally posted by MichaeltheGreat

Just because they aren't stupid enough to proclaim their intentions doesn't mean they lack intention. Evidence isn't needed, the simple fact is that there is only room for one superpower, and we're it.

Not for much longer, methinks. And certainly not with an attitude like that, and the fact that Iraqi teenagers with peashooters seem to be able to own your finest at will. It's quite funny. I just caught the tail end of British Imperialist feeling. Now it's happening to you guys.

Welcome to irrelevance.

Besides, read Sun Tzu. The goal is to **** them before they have the ability to do anything, not to wait around until after they've carried out whatever their intentions are.

Everything he said was rendered irrelevant by nuclear weapons and the age of total war. Now it's just fodder for sexually inadequate fantasists like Donald Rumself.

[Commy]

Why does China want a large military? So that it can take Taiwan and South Korea? Well, you are partially right, but China wouldn't need a 12-13 million man army to do that, now would it?

No, China doesn't just want to be powerful and have the ability to attack whoever it wants, no no no...China wants to be powerful, attack whoever it wants, AND not have to worry about US retaliation or interference...

Why does the United States need a larger military you ask? I'm not in favor of big militaries, but let's think about this...how many people here at apolyton just absolutely despise America?

A good number...in fact, I would bet a good number of people in the world absolutely HATE America, probably more than there are American citizens...if this doesn't convince you of how many enemies America has, I don't know what will...I just hope I don't have to bring up things like 9/11 which are tragic but unfortunately overexagerrated too much...

The fact is, China is so under-developed, that it has 6 times more troops than America, and yet pays about a sixth on its military budget as America does...America spends 370 billion annually, China manages only 67.5 billion...

China needs a larger military, literally, because the quality of its military is so poor compared to its greatest threats...America and Europe...

Now true, the quality of your nuclear arsenal doesn't really matter, a nuke is a nuke, but consider this...

America spends more money on military than any other country...in fact, it spends the same as the next 12 countries combined...of those 12 countries, atleast 6 could be considered close allies, and only one (besides China), South Korea, could really be considered an enemy or hostile nation to the US...

China doesn't even need a larger military to take over other countries, China needs a larger military to prevent becoming just another one of America's many subordinate "allies" under the American military hierarchy...

With the European Union gradually emerging, and coming strong, China not only is outnumbered in military, but it also is in money and industry...

The United States, with a GDP of 11.75 trillion dollars, controls more than a fifth of the world's economy...add in the EU as its closest ally, which by the way, closely follows America in GDP, and you have a free nation alliance that controls 40% of the worlds goods and economy...

If you add India and Japan into all this mess, America and its little club of friends own more than half the worlds economy...

China on the otherhand, owns its puny 13% of the world economy, and is outnumbered not only in cold cash but is outdone in its military technology, progress in its Space program, and even with its high economic growth rate, will eventually fall far behind the US and Europe...unless China has a superlarge and bloated military...

Not only does China need a military to defend the nation from other nations, but it also needs to defend the nation from its people...it is most likely that the Chinese people would be very sympathetic to the American and European alliance, and if conflict arose between China and America, the chinese people could very likely end up as the closest allies to the Americans and Europe...China needs its troops to maintain the governments power and control over the people, not just from Western culture...

Are all these wide theories? Maybe...

Are all these just WW 3 fantasies? Maybe...

But the point is, unless China takes drastic measures, the shear size of its potential enemies and threats can prove even to large for a nuclear attack...simply put, not enough nukes to hit Europe and America...

On the other hand, if America stops increasing its military size and budget, China will become even more of a threat and may be one of the first "flagged" countries, if you will, to undermine America's unofficial role as World Police...

I don't like conflict, war, and am not in support of large militaries...but unfortunately, freedom is not free quite yet, but hopefully, if China falls, freedom can become quite cheaper...

[Joseph]

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: China is teh evil, OMFG!111!@

Originally posted by Agathon


I thought the answer would be obvious: the continuing belligerent attitude of the United States.

Why does the United States need such a ridiculously large military? It's not as if they do anything useful with it other than piss people off.

Our Army is just over 500,000. Our Air Force is around 350,000, The Navy is under 400,000, and the Marine Corp is at 180,000. China has around 2,000,000 in the Army along.