PRC creates online propaganda units

[DinoDoc]

Originally posted by Bosh
Nice dodge there by the way.

The PRC only hires the best.

[Az]

Oh, ****.

This thread is NOT about UR. It's about the concept of online government propaganda in general, and it's ethical value, esp. vis a vis other propaganda sources on the web.

[Agathon]

Maybe cuz the PRC deserves it more than the US?

Hardly, it isn't democratic. That's the overwhelming reason Israel gets singled out (despite the paranoia of some of its citizens).

But I think it is silly to criticize the PRC in the way Poly's Sinophobes do. That country is slowly getting better, opening itself to the world and makes a lot of stuff we use. Added to that, it is the repository of one of the world's great cultures and has historically been quite benign compared to countries like, say, Spain.

And it's an American thing. Outside of East Asia, where there are regional rivalries, most folk don't have a big problem with China. Political elites in the US have identified China as a competitor – hence the hysteria in that country over everything China does.

Ask yourself this. How many nuclear weapons do the Chinese have, and why do they have so few when it was perfectly feasible for them to have multiple times that amount. The only compelling explanation I have ever seen offered is genuine restraint.

[Az]

or that they don't need more than that of those extremely expensive weapons ( both to build and maintain), realizing they've got enough for MAD?

[DaShi]

Originally posted by Urban Ranger


Meanwhile, DaShi here has been silent on virtually all threads critical of the US, while quite verbal in criticising the PRC.

Interesting.

[cough]Strawman[/cough]

1. It's not true?

2. Doesn't matter in this discussion.

[DaShi]

The paper cited an example of how the force works in practice, saying it might react to, say, online criticism of the police force by posting positive views on the law enforcers.

Originally posted by Bosh
The Chinese government sends North Korean refugees back to the North to face death or imprisonment instead of forwarding them to South Korea or America. This is evil.

Originally posted by Urban Ranger


While you think it's a bad idea to try talking with Dear Leader to get DPRK open up more.

[Agathon]

or that they don't need more than that of those extremely expensive weapons ( both to build and maintain), realizing they've got enough for MAD

That doesn't really fit the evidence, if the USA and USSR are our models. The Chinese just aren't particularly belligerent by world standards. That's not saying that they are perfect, but I'd sooner worry about the Japanese.

I see a Canadian MP got in trouble for calling Japanese soldiers "Japs" and "bastards". IMHO they're lucky that's all he called them.

[Dinner]

Finally UR's activities here at poly have been explained.

[Az]

That doesn't really fit the evidence, if the USA and USSR are our models. The Chinese just aren't particularly belligerent by world standards. That's not saying that they are perfect, but I'd sooner worry about the Japanese.

It's not smart to be belligerent if you can't walk the walk. The USSR and the USA had much more economical power going for them. It's not a fair comparison.

In any case, the behaviour on the international stage is largely a side-issue in the judgement of ethical value, since the farther away from the government the object of the power's interest is, the more alike they all behave. Thus, bar a couple of exceptions, the true judgement of the country's ethical value is in it's society and policies towards it's citizens.

[DaShi]

Originally posted by Agathon
But I think it is silly to criticize the PRC in the way Poly's Sinophobes do. That country is slowly getting better, opening itself to the world and makes a lot of stuff we use. Added to that, it is the repository of one of the world's great cultures and has historically been quite benign compared to countries like, say, Spain.

Even I'll agreed that some posters here go too far. I don't want to name names as I usually stop reading those posts and forget who writes them. But to ignore all topics that may criticize China on a forum for discussion is foolish. Unless we just want to turn this into an anti-American-I-love-Communism forum.

And it's an American thing. Outside of East Asia, where there are regional rivalries, most folk don't have a big problem with China. Political elites in the US have identified China as a competitor – hence the hysteria in that country over everything China does.

Perhaps for America, China is the regional rival. The Chinese should be flattered. As for criticism, they had better get used to it. It ain't going to get better as China becomes more developed and more influencial in the world.

Ask yourself this. How many nuclear weapons do the Chinese have, and why do they have so few when it was perfectly feasible for them to have multiple times that amount. The only compelling explanation I have ever seen offered is genuine restraint.

A good point, but how many nuclear weapons did the Soviet Union have? How many does NK have? How many does Syria have? How many does Saudi Arabia have? How many does Zimbabwe have? How many does France have?

China isn't as rich as it may look. It's getting there, but living here, you notice it still has a way to go. Getting into an arms race is the last thing they want. Plus, I genuinely beleive that the current China has no desire to start or partake in a nuclear war, and only wants enough as a deterent.

[DaShi]

Originally posted by Agathon
That doesn't really fit the evidence, if the USA and USSR are our models. The Chinese just aren't particularly belligerent by world standards. That's not saying that they are perfect, but I'd sooner worry about the Japanese.

This about a country that was literally calling for blood a month ago? This about a country that attacked its weaker neighbor just to send a message? This about a country that is quite obvious about seeking better and stronger military technology? This from a country where space is primarily a military objective even such that they gave their first astronaut a gun? This about a country that passed a bill allowing for war with and the possible decimation of a neighboring island? This about a country when a political incident occurred willfully had its own people turn on eachother just to save its leader's face? This about a country that destroyed any hope of future peaceful dissention by running over children with tanks?

When you say China, are you really talking about Taiwan? Because I'm confused.

[DaShi]

Originally posted by Agathon
That's not saying that they are perfect, but I'd sooner worry about the Japanese.

I see a Canadian MP got in trouble for calling Japanese soldiers "Japs" and "bastards". IMHO they're lucky that's all he called them.

And tell me. What in the last fifty years have the Japanese done to warrant such worry from Agathon?

I believe that you are becoming blind in this issue. By painting the US so bleakly as you have done in the past, you are forcing yourself to make China (which you have labelled its polar opposite) into a nigh Utopia. Thus, China's own opinions about the Japanese may be affecting yours. I don't want to say this is a Canadian thing, but I find it common among Canadians here in China who truly hate the US to love China and blindly ignore its faults.

[Agathon]

And tell me. What in the last fifty years have the Japanese done to warrant such worry from Agathon?

Dude, if you come from where I do, you will find quite a few older guys who were Japanese prisoners of war. They hold a grudge, and after they tell you what happened to them, it isn't hard to develop a dim view of Japanese militarism.

This about a country that was literally calling for blood a month ago? This about a country that attacked its weaker neighbor just to send a message? This about a country that is quite obvious about seeking better and stronger military technology? This from a country where space is primarily a military objective even such that they gave their first astronaut a gun? This about a country that passed a bill allowing for war with and the possible decimation of a neighboring island? This about a country when a political incident occurred willfully had its own people turn on eachother just to save its leader's face? This about a country that destroyed any hope of future peaceful dissention by running over children with tanks?

Now you're just exaggerating.

I'll take your indictment of the PRC and raise you the United States in the last twenty years. The death toll from US policy has been substantially higher methinks.

[Agathon]

By painting the US so bleakly as you have done in the past, you are forcing yourself to make China (which you have labelled its polar opposite) into a nigh Utopia.

I've never said it was a utopia; just that it is nowhere near the international rogue state that the Americans like to paint.

And Taiwan is part of China.

[DaShi]

Originally posted by Agathon

And tell me. What in the last fifty years have the Japanese done to warrant such worry from Agathon?

Dude, if you come from where I do, you will find quite a few older guys who were Japanese prisoners of war. They hold a grudge, and after they tell you what happened to them, it isn't hard to develop a dim view of Japanese militarism.

My grandfather hates the Japanese, and he was stationed in N. Africa. I believe that Japan is a different country today than it was. And given it's current condition, no real threat to anyone.

This about a country that was literally calling for blood a month ago? This about a country that attacked its weaker neighbor just to send a message? This about a country that is quite obvious about seeking better and stronger military technology? This from a country where space is primarily a military objective even such that they gave their first astronaut a gun? This about a country that passed a bill allowing for war with and the possible decimation of a neighboring island? This about a country when a political incident occurred willfully had its own people turn on eachother just to save its leader's face? This about a country that destroyed any hope of future peaceful dissention by running over children with tanks?

Now you're just exaggerating.

A little. But not much.

I'll take your indictment of the PRC and raise you the United States in the last twenty years. The death toll from US policy has been substantially higher methinks.

But my argument isn't that the US is not belligerent. I can't prove that.

My argument is that China is not a pacifist country. Never really was. And now it's aggression is about on par with that of the Chin dynasty.