Creationism on the rise in Kans... the Netherlands?!

[Locutus]

Originally posted by Winston
I think the issue is the Dutch government wants to hold a hearing. I saw no mention of proposed changes to what should be taught in science courses.

The minister said (as quoted in the article) that the scientists should "find a place" for religious ideas in their theories. Not only should the ideas of the religious community apparently be taught in schools, it should be treated as legitime scientific theory -- even if it turns out it isn't. We should just keep searching until find a way...

[Boris Godunov]

Originally posted by Winston
Thanks a lot. I edited in the "explanations for the origin of life" bit within 30 seconds or so, but that was what I meant the post to say. I did not intend to backtrack or be dishonest.

No, that's not where you're being dishonest. Editing your post was fine, but accusing me of engaging in a strawman based on what you originally wrote is dishonest, especially since I clearly quote what you originally said. My response to your original phrase was entirely appropriate. Your editing it and then claiming I'm engaged in a strawman to score a cheap point is not. It's certainly more antagonizing than a .

[Winston]

I did not change the meaning of it. First, it read "Because it's a scientific problem?", after the edit it read "Because pursuing explanations for the origin of life is a scientific problem?".

The strawman remark referred to your posing the question "How is religious philosophy remotely a scientific problem?". I never claimed any such thing, neither before or after the edit, so that's what makes it a strawman.

But I'm through with you. Don't want to have nothing to do with people who accuse me of being dishonest. Especially if they're also as pompous and full of themselves as you've shown yourself to be as of late.

[Boris Godunov]

Originally posted by Winston
I did not change the meaning of it. First, it read "Because it's a scientific problem?", after the edit it read "Because searching for explanation for the origin of life is a scientific problem?".

The Minister's position is that religion is short-changed in the evolutionary theory. So why would I not assume you were referring to religion?

Evolution isn't a scientific "problem," so why should I think you mean anything else?

The strawman remark referred to your posing the questioon "How is religious philosophy remotely a scientific problem?". I never claimed any such thing, neither before or after the edit, so that's what makes it a strawman.

As I said already, adding the clarification is fine. But you didn't just add the clarification, you added it and then accused me--incorrectly--of engaging in a strawman. My question about religious philosophy was appropriate given both how unclear your statement was and the fact that the Minister is explicitley asking scientists to consider religious theories. If your statement was so clear, why would you add the clarification, anyway?

But instead of saying "Wait, that's not what I meant, here's the clarification," you instead claimed I'd made a "strawman," despite it being a reasonable interpretation of the initial vague statement. That's where the dishonesty comes from. It doesn't require me being "full of myself" to point out the cheap tactic.

[Urban Ranger]

Originally posted by Winston
I say dialogue on topics of mutual interest between people from different fields of a democratic society never hurt anyone.

The thing is, there is no mutual interest.

The Creationists don't care about evolution, most of them don't even understand evolution. They only want to push an agenda.

The scientists are interested in theories, but Creationism isn't one. There's nothing to look at.

[Dinner]

Shame on Holland for even entertaining these nutjobs.

[Kuciwalker]

Re: Creationism on the rise in Kans... the Netherlands?!

Originally posted by Locutus
But over here we're not talking about some backward state in the middle of nowhere in the south, we're talking about the national government!

They're probably about the same size

[Locutus]

In terms of population the Netherlands is eight times the size of Kansas

[Urban Ranger]

Creationists is the best evidence that Creationism is bunk

[molly bloom]

Originally posted by Urban Ranger
Creationists is the best evidence that Creationism is bunk

Creationists 'are'.

When engaging in mocking the nutjobs, it behoves us to adhere to rules of grammar and spelling, thus exciting them to a teeth-gnashing mouth-frothing frenzy of anti-pointyheadism.

[Dr Strangelove]

My understanding is that the creationists were handily defeated during the debate before the Kansas School Board. I suspect that the same thing will happen in the Netherlands. I think it makes since to have them speak in a public forum. They will collect their arguments for presentation, allowing evolutionists an opportunity to address each and every point in detail. In the end it's better this way.

[Boris Godunov]

Your understanding on Kansas is wrong. Evolutionists didn't participate, they boycotted. By doing so, they insured there would be no stamp of scientific legitimacy on it. And that's exactly the impression the media got. So I'd say that's generally the best way to handle such situations.

[OzzyKP]

OMG!!11!1!!1!! A discussion!!1!!!1 Oh noes!!

[chequita guevara]

Originally posted by Odin
My god, the plauge of stupidity is spreading.

Let's just all move to Mars and let the insane people have Earth.

[OzzyKP]

The red planet.