Osama bin Laden's view of the Crusades

[Imran Siddiqui]

Shevarnardze tried... believe you me .

[Pax]

Originally posted by Ned


No doubt that massacre was the main reason the crusades are held in disrepute by all. But the reason for the crusades in the first place was somewhat justified.

Ned,
I agree that you have offered reasons that have become acceptable justifications for waging wars but I personally find the idea of war, pillaging, and rape unacceptable and when done in the name of religion an abomination. Bottom line the crusades were wrong. You must agree that the only wars that god actually authorized in his name are either in the bible, koran or torah.

[Ramo]

mned you ar a biogot. simpl ea s that. acholohol distillt he threugh.. and that's the truth.

[curtsibling]

I still say the movie is worth going to see.

The accusation that it sympathises with terrorism is retarded.

The movie is respectful to christians and shows them to
be honourable, except for a small handful of corrupt men.

.

[dannubis]

yes, but in the end the christians loose !!!

[curtsibling]

Originally posted by dannubis
yes, but in the end the christians loose !!!

They don't lose, they only pull out of Jerusalem, and allow the moosies to take it.

And that is after putting up such a fight that Saladin offers terms.

Losing is when the enemy storm the place and kill everyone.

.

[dannubis]

but thats not good enough for ned...

christians always win, didn't you know ?

because they are always right...

[curtsibling]

Sarcasm acknowledged.

But Ned should realise that no-one is ever right.

Our history is built on delusions and fables of grandness.

Everyone has their own outlook on the world...

[Boris Godunov]

Originally posted by Ned
I'm sorry, Boris. But you liberals are tone deaf to anti-Americanism and anti-Christianity.

Or, more likely, you're so paranoid about it that you infer such feelings into anything you can because it helps make you feel justified in being a lunatic.

In fact, you are shocked when a movie displays genuine patriotism or belief, as in Mel Gibson's the Passion of the Christ, or perhaps in his Braveheart.

I don't think anyone was "shocked" by the belief in PotC, but rather the gore and some subtle anti-semitism. And who the hell said anything bad about Braveheart (besides the British)? You continue to imagine things.

That's why you see Anti-Americanism in everything. Your paranoid mind makes it up. I can't imagine anyone living in such a...well, Nedaverse. What a strange, distorted place it must be!

[Ned]

Boris, I think your attitude would be entirely different if out of the blue one of the fish in the movie would utter a completely gratuitous smear of gays.

[Ned]

Originally posted by dannubis
but thats not good enough for ned...

christians always win, didn't you know ?

because they are always right...

It is not whether they win or lose that I object to in this movie. It is that the Christians were portrayed as essentially evil people.

[dannubis]

well, they did pick a fight with something they could not hope to handle and got their arse handed to them.

and catholics were / are people who can not stand the tought that someone can have other, not necessary less noble, ideals in life than they do.

and that is what is shown in the movie. of course you need a vilain. and since it were the christians that instigated this war, it is a christian vilain. simple, and historically not far from the truth.

[Ned]

Originally posted by dannubis
well, they did pick a fight with something they could not hope to handle and got their arse handed to them.

and catholics were / are people who can not stand the tought that someone can have other, not necessary less noble, ideals in life than they do.

and that is what is shown in the movie. of course you need a vilain. and since it were the christians that instigated this war, it is a christian vilain. simple, and historically not far from the truth.

Pick a fight? Reconquest of Jerusalem had long been on the muslim radar. Salah al-Din was running around he ME in the years prior to the war solidifying his base before he launched the war. He also made alliance with the Eastern Roman Empire in 1185, illustrating his intentions.

Dannubis -- your statement about Catholics this and Catholics that illustrates your own bigotry.

[Ming]

come on guys... while I know it's tough not to get personal on discussions involving religion... talk the topic and not the posters.

[Boris Godunov]

Originally posted by Ned
Boris, I think your attitude would be entirely different if out of the blue one of the fish in the movie would utter a completely gratuitous smear of gays.

Yeah, but that's not at all comparable to what was said in the movie, for pete's sake. You're reading into it something that simply isn't there.

Funny how religious moralists and other conservatives can complain about the evils in America with impunity, but a harmless joke in a kid's movie simply about American's buying things becomes the most awful attack on America ever!

How about when Jerry Falwell and Pat Robertson blamed 9/11 on Americans? Now that's something to get upset over. Finding Nemo definitely isn't.