Was it inevitable that the US lost the Vietnam war?

[Dis]

Originally posted by DAVOUT


I have never heard any top military explaning that protecting the SV without invading NV was not feasible : first military failure.

The management of the war was a military duty which apparently was not recognized as properly done : second military failure.

It is not permissible for any military figure to speak out against the battle plan without fear of losing his job. He can't go criticising politcians battle plan.

[Sandman]

Imagine you're playing civ.

You load up a transport with units, and send it to the other side of the world to conquer a small, weak civ. Unfortunately, this force meets unexpected resistance, and will need reinforcements in order to win. Building these reinforcements disrupts your build plan, significantly slowing your wonder and spaceship part production. And then you need to send more reinforcements.

You could easily win if you diverted your production to total war - that is what the small, weak civ is doing. But doing so will mean you lose the space and wonder race.

That's Vietnam.

[DAVOUT]

Originally posted by Dissident


It is not permissible for any military figure to speak out against the battle plan without fear of losing his job. He can't go criticising politcians battle plan.

There are occurences of high ranking soldiers who fought enough for their ideas that they were dismissed. Honorable men dont wait for permission.

[Ned]

Lancer, Westmorland always wanted a lot more troops so that he could go on the offensive against the North. He was consistently denied the requested manpower, year in and year out. McNamara knew this. He (and Johnson) intentionally supplied Westmorland just enough troops not to lose. Never enough to win.

So, while the American people still supported the war and were told we were "winning," McNamara and Johnson never planned on winning.

[Ned]

Originally posted by Sandman
Imagine you're playing civ.

You load up a transport with units, and send it to the other side of the world to conquer a small, weak civ. Unfortunately, this force meets unexpected resistance, and will need reinforcements in order to win. Building these reinforcements disrupts your build plan, significantly slowing your wonder and spaceship part production. And then you need to send more reinforcements.

You could easily win if you diverted your production to total war - that is what the small, weak civ is doing. But doing so will mean you lose the space and wonder race.

That's Vietnam.

In a way, yes. But it was criminal for Johnson to conduct the war the way he did, getting Americans and others killed by the hundreds of thousand without any plan for victory. As I said, Johnson and McNamara intentionally denied Westmorland the troops necessary to go on the offensive.

[Lancer]

"Lancer, Westmorland always wanted a lot more troops so that he could go on the offensive against the North. He was consistently denied the requested manpower, year in and year out. McNamara knew this. He (and Johnson) intentionally supplied Westmorland just enough troops not to lose. Never enough to win.

So, while the American people still supported the war and were told we were "winning," McNamara and Johnson never planned on winning"

Excellent post Ned! Answers the others posts better than I could have. Diss, Davout, see above.

[DAVOUT]

Originally posted by Lancer
"Lancer, Westmorland always wanted a lot more troops so that he could go on the offensive against the North. He was consistently denied the requested manpower, year in and year out. McNamara knew this. He (and Johnson) intentionally supplied Westmorland just enough troops not to lose. Never enough to win.

So, while the American people still supported the war and were told we were "winning," McNamara and Johnson never planned on winning"

Excellent post Ned! Answers the others posts better than I could have. Diss, Davout, see above.

This Westmorland had no backbone, or he was sold to Johnson.

[Admiral]

The Vietnam was merely one in a wave of other wars, fought by the people to keep drive out European imperialists. These people won every single war. In Vietnam, we fought on the side of the imperialists. Our defeat was inevitable.

[Ned]

Davout, in the end, I think Westmorland is kicking himself that he did not resign in protest.

[chequita guevara]

The Jews stabbed us in the back and stole victory from us at Versailles!

[Tassadar500]

Originally posted by chegitz guevara
The Jews stabbed us in the back and stole victory from us at Versailles!

It's not our fault.

[chequita guevara]

They stole at the peace table what they couldn't win on the battlefield! If it weren't for the Jews (Liberal politicians) Germany (the U.S.) would have prevailed in the Great War (Vietnam).

Conservatives just cannot comprehend the fact that the war was unwinnable from our side, because we weren't prepared to destroy the Earth to win, well, not win, so much as call it a draw.

[General Ludd]

The problem with conservatives is that they think violence solves everything - that there is no problem that can't be solved, provided you have enough tanks and bombs.

[Agathon]

The problem with conservatives is that they think violence solves everything - that there is no problem that can't be solved, provided you have enough tanks and bombs.

And as long as they aren't the ones under fire.

[Ted Striker]

VERY TRUE