Thomas L. Friedman: "The World is Flat"

[DanS]

Yeh, but they're probably eating gruel and living lifestyles similar to the Amish.

[Imran Siddiqui]

Originally posted by VJ
Uhm?

Are we talking about same sort of joints here? Or are we using different currency (I'm using US dollars)? Or are US pizzas 20 inches in diameter? What's so funny?

Large pizzas are about 18-20 in in diameter, as DanS said. If such pizza is $10 it is insanely cheap (and would have been 10 years ago as well).

[KrazyHorse]

I used to get 2 larges and 4 cans of soda for 19$CAN as recently as 2 years ago.

[Sandman]

A large, delivered pizza is hardly the 'humblest of meals'. Unless there's some bizarre cultural thing going on here.

In any case, Norwegians are 3cm taller than Americans, so it's not as if they're going hungry.

[Sandman]

A bit of simple googling reveals that Norwegians eat loads of pizzas, possibly more than Americans per head.

Aftenposten Article

Slice: America's favorite pizza weblog!

[KrazyHorse]

Contrasting "the American dream" with "the European daydream," Mr. Norberg described the difference: "Economic growth in the last 25 years has been 3 percent per annum in the U.S., compared to 2.2 percent in the E.U.

I suppose he's going to ignore the fact that over the last 25 years the european population growth rate has been about 0.3% per annum while the US population growth rate has been about 1.0% per annum, meaning that the economic growth per resident in Europe is virtually identical to the population growth per resident in the US?

[DanS]

But he's also including 3 recessions for only 2 business cycles in the US...

Then ef will come in and say that there are some hedonic factors going on and will try to adjust the numbers.

And then I will say that I'm skeptical at his adjustments.

It's all been done... before...

[Imran Siddiqui]

Originally posted by Sandman
A large, delivered pizza is hardly the 'humblest of meals'. Unless there's some bizarre cultural thing going on here.

Can you name a humbler one?

Well, I guess hamburgers from a fast food joint or something, but aside from fast food, there ain't anything humbler.

[Spiffor]

Originally posted by Imran Siddiqui
Can you name a humbler one?

The supermarket crappiest (but also cheapest) pasta/rice. That's the cheapest you can get, as long as you have a house to prepare the meal.

I don't know for the US, but delivery pizza is fairly expansive here (almost twice the price of a takeaway pizza)

[KrazyHorse]

delivery in north america is the same price as takeout

No wonder you ****ing euros hate freedom.

[Imran Siddiqui]

Originally posted by KrazyHorse
delivery in north america is the same price as takeout

No wonder you ****ing euros hate freedom.

And what's so hard about takeing away pizza?

[Sandman]

Originally posted by Imran Siddiqui
Can you name a humbler one?

Well, I guess hamburgers from a fast food joint or something, but aside from fast food, there ain't anything humbler.

Anything that can cooked with a microwave and nothing else.
Heavily processed meat products.
Pasta and rice, as Spiffor said.
Soup.
Bargain tinned stuff.
Chips.
This being Norway, there's probably a really cheap fish-based food as well.

Do American pizza places have lots of tramps in them?

British pizza places will usually deliver for free if you order a minimum amount, of say, £10's worth. But the delivery culture hasn't really caught on here.

[Urban Ranger]

Originally posted by Drake Tungsten

http://www.nytimes.com/2005/04/17/weekinreview/17bawer.html

Superior economic model indeed...

I reckon el freako could rip it apart nicely.

[Drake Tungsten]

Well, we all know you can't...

[lord of the mark]

Originally posted by DanS
Yeh, but they're probably eating gruel and living lifestyles similar to the Amish.

assuming they are well along in child bearing, and not just having their first kid and then moving to modern O neighborhoods in the outer boroughs or suburbs (and thus have 4 to 6 kids, not one or two) AND that the head of household doesnt have a good job as an accountant or techie on Wall Street, and so earn rather more than 75k, then they are probably living with rather less space per person then middle class Americans consider standard. Like 2 kids sharing a bedroom routinely, so a family of 6 (2 parent and 4 kids) can fit into a Washington Heights 3 bedroom apartment - (and dont expect to have time for a leisurely shower every day, either, since everyone maybe sharing one bathroom). IIUC the Modern Orthodox community in Washington Heights is largley compose of young families whose adults met and married farther down the upper West Side, and who headed to WH for CHEAPER apartments. Note also that Orthodox, modern and otherwise, have been moving to the suburbs of NYC in considerable numbers - modern O to Nassau County, IIUC, and hasidim to Monsey, in Rockland, Monroe in Orange, and BEYOND.

Note also that total family size does not equal household size. My sister in law has 8 kids, but by the time number 8 came along, 2 were married, and 2 others were away at "boarding school" (if i dare use such words for an ultra O yeshiva).


Note also when I lived in Baltimore one often heard of Orthodox families whod moved from NYC, taking lower incomes to avoid the high cost of housing in NYC. Baltimore, with a large O community, was a much easier place for them to fit in then Phoenix.

Here in Greater Washington, Orthodox Jews, traditionally residing in Kemp Mill in Silver Spring, and in Wheaton, have been moving up toward Olney, again for cheaper housing.