The US sends suspects to nasty foreign countries to "collect intelligence"

[Admiral]

Originally posted by Whaleboy


Why mention this? What is so special about the death penalty that you would mention it, and makes anti-DP but pro-Justice (in the sense of responsibility, weight of the law and trial by evidence) weaker than pro-DP arguments here?

I was making two arguments in my post. First, I stated that torture, even of terrorists, is wrong. Second, I stated that we cannot really be certain that the people we torture are, in fact, terrorism, and that even if we allowed that torture is a viable sentence for terrorists, it should not be applied unless we knew, beyond a shadow of doubt, who was a terrorist, and who wasn't. Now, I am not a fan of thea death penalty, but it falls under the second argument. I am against it because it is hard to conclusively prove guilt, and there have been cases where innocent people are put to death. However, if we could conclusively prove that a person is guilty of specific crimes, than I would not be adverse to applying the DP. Hence, by specifically mentioning the DP, I was differentiating people being put to death, and people being tortured (which is an important distinction to make).
I was also trying to forestall the right-wing criticism: you're just weak on terror.

[pchang]

People against US foreign policy: Stop US imperialism. Stop interfering with the internal operations of other countries.
US: Here are people we suspect of terrorism that are citizens of other countries. We will send them back and let the other countries handle things without our interference.
People against US foreign policy: Stop torture of prisoners. Start interfering with the internal operations of other countries.
US: Hmmm???

[Provost Harrison]

US send people abroad to collect intelligence? Why, can't they find enough in their own country?

[Ramo]

People against US foreign policy: Stop US imperialism. Stop interfering with the internal operations of other countries.
US: Here are people we suspect of terrorism that are citizens of other countries. We will send them back and let the other countries handle things without our interference.
People against US foreign policy: Stop torture of prisoners. Start interfering with the internal operations of other countries.
US: Hmmm???

I don't know who these people you are referring to are, or how your "logic" works, but it's more like:

US: There's a Canadian citizen, born in Syria, who is coming back from a family vacation from Tunisia, stopping at LaGuardia. So based on nebulous suspicions of Islamist terrorism, we naturally we deny him due process, and ship him off to Syria where Islamists are brutally repressed, and militant Islamist suspects are invariably tortured. Freedom.

People against US foreign policy:

[Urban Ranger]

Originally posted by Drake Tungsten

Nice places to send your suspects, Mr Bush.

If only we were fighting Falun Gong. The PRC is probably way better at torturing people than these amateurs...

Nah, you did better. You killed them all at Waco.

[Dinner]

By all accounts they killed themselves. They all drank the cult leader's "special" cool-aid then the last few burned down the compound.

[DaShi]

Ah, sweet hypocracy in all its glory.

[DinoDoc]

Yeah when I first saw this thread, I thought UR felt left out that we didn't send them to the PRC.

[Alexander's Horse]

Is this part of the liberty and democracy drive?

[Drake Tungsten]

Well, if Egypt, Syria, Saudi Arabia and Jordan all become democratic, this won't be a problem anymore, will it?

[GePap]

Originally posted by Alexander's Horse
Is this part of the liberty and democracy drive?

Yes, its the part were the sanctimonius think up as many ways to say "screw our values, cause we don;t like brown people", that right, DD?

How many people has the uS indicted right now on terrorism in the last 3 years? How many succesfully prosecuted? We have, what, 2? Less? Its pathetic.

There ius NO way to defend this outrageous and utterly immoral practice. None. I am still surprised at Oerdin for defending the complete abuse of that Canadian citizen.

[DinoDoc]

Originally posted by GePap


Yes, its the part were the sanctimonius think up as many ways to say "screw our values, cause we don;t like brown people", that right, DD?

You might want to redirect that troll to someone that actually gives a damn about spreading democracy and freedom in the Muslim World or elsewhere.

[GePap]

Yes, we know how little you care, just enough to make snarky posts with the same value as a Fez post, but with less comedic value.

[DinoDoc]

Now for a serious post, I don't really agree with the policy but seeing the faux indignation from a poster who has and continues to defend torture and other human rights indignities was a bit much and brought out the fun poster in me.

PS Here's a quarter, GePap. Go call someone who cares about your opinion of them.

[GePap]

Man, you are a cheap bastard, aren't you? Well, in civilized places (ie, NOT Mississippi) calls cost a bit more now.

So pony up!

Thought, given how often your gives a **** is broken, I doubt that you got the money. Sad.