Rugby - Hands Off, Wattle!

[Havak]

But it is gospel, every word of it, surely?

The only Scot for Saturdays game has had to drop out and has been replaced by a Paddy - Taylor aggravated his hamstring in training and is replaced by Easterby (the man who replaced Dayglo on the tour).

[Havak]

I see Fiji almost gave the ABs an opposed training run? Apparently all it lacked was full contact tackling?

I actually think it's a great result for the Lions - AB overconfidence has killed them in all the big games for 18 years and boy will they be overconfident now?

*edit* I wonder if Ravagon can tell me what part of NZ Sitiveni Sivivatu comes from?

[finbar]

For that matter, what part of New Zealand does ravagon come from? North Auckland?

[ravagon]

It could be worse. I could hail from West Auckland.

[ravagon]

Originally posted by Havak

I actually think it's a great result for the Lions - AB overconfidence has killed them in all the big games for 18 years and boy will they be overconfident now?

So you would have me believe that an AB loss to Fiji would be seen as bad news for the Lions then?
Just imagine if Fiji had nearly put up an unanswered ton ... The Lions might as well've gone home?

[Edit: Flippin' spelling.]

[Frozzy]

Quick notes from ye olde game:

- Lions defensively look very good. That Maori squad does have some game breaking runners like Tipoki, Gear, MacDonald, and McAllister, and none of them (except MacDonald's try) came close to breaking it

- Lions scrum ate the Maori one piecemeal until Sheridan got sinbinned (if you're going to punch someone make sure you hit so he can't play again ). Hayman looked very small indeed.

- Walsh was crap (shock). Missed some obvious infringements and had no control on the events going on between the two packs. Simon Shaw had a few blatant boots in the head which weren't anything close to rucking. Wasn't Mr. Shawsent off for less by a Kiwi ref last year?

- Dawson showed why he is a 3rd rate half back. Awful passing.

- Jones looked good considering he had Dawson passing to him

- D'Arcy should just go home. When you flip a player without the ball with 20 minutes to go out of frustration you may as well go home. You're not a thug.

- Shane Williams. He's 4' 10" and as light as a feather. Frankly he'll have no chance taking on people like Tana Umaga, Ma'a Nonu, et al. So, there must be a reason he is on there, right? I assumed it would be his god given talents with the ball in hand, but apparantly Mr Woodward and the rest of the Lions back line think differently.

- Was O'Connell the only one playing for his jersey out there?

- Michael Owen needs to run when he has the ball in hand, not try to dance around Rico Gear, Luke McAllister et al. Hit a ruck for once!

- Thompson's throwing was about as accurate as a spewing cat. Poor Simon Shaw couldn't get anything decent, and the one time he did, Shaw started off the only go-forward ball the Lions had in the first half.

I don't think the loss was representative of the test side as a whole, but frankly there are a good number of people who can put their bums in their armchairs for the flight home.

[child of Thor]

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/rugby_union/international/4080356.stm

I'll catch the match on Sunday grandstand(i hope). I cant put the loss down to having too many englishmen in the side either It was a farely even anglo-welsh mix with the odd irishman in the mix.

Shame we cant seem to blend so well

As for comment on the game i'll wait till i've seen it and give my take on it for you to tear down

[ravagon]

Mmm. Well that'd be their wake-up call I guess. It was always going to be a tough one though.
I wouldn't go so far as to suggest that they won't win a single test but they have a lot of work in front of them.

I don't particularly think they can take automatic wins in all of their other games either. Auckland and Canterbury, for starters, will probably put together very tough performances - particularly if the Lions are saving their better players for the tests.

They shouldn't really have too much trouble in Wellington though.

[Havak]

So you would have me believe that an AB loss to Fiji would be seen as bad news for the Lions then?

Bizarrely in some ways I would yes.

The ABs are at their very worst when expected to sweep all before them – and at their best when fighting back out of a corner. Lets hope for your sake they learned lessons from RWC 2003 about over confidence?

Well I said the Maori game would be my barometer for the series - and I agree with Ravagon there is now considerable worry that the tests will be one sided affairs. But hopefully the Abs can bounce back and make a fight of it (Joking!).

I suspect the Lions will probably beat all the Provincial sides as it happens. Wednesdays squad starts to have a test look about it – probably the only change I would have off hand is ditch Thomas and play Murphy. The Maoris had to get very 'creative' to assemble that side in the first place as well didn’t they - McDonald and Hollah etc are Maoris?

By crikey the Lions were poor going forward though weren't they? Defensively they were quite impressive and it took consistent poor refereeing to let the Maoris score. Walsh is something of a controversial choice here given his appalling conduct at the world cup and he did enough to prove again that he has no idea about the coal face (wrongly pinging White several times) and is perhaps a little suspect when asked to be impartial with British players. He made Hoeniss look good – and I can think of no greater insult.

All that aside though the Maoris were clearly hungrier and you cannot deny them the fact they deserved to win for that alone.

Not many Lions players did themselves any good from this one, some ruled themselves out of the tests completely I think. For example I disagree with Kalius – Jones had a bad game with a touch of the headless chicken about his decision making, Owen has blown his test chances as has Williams. Sheridan was stupid to get caught for retaliation – lack of experience showing?

Sadly the problem may have been too few Englishmen – and perhaps one too many as Hill had a poor game.

One of the very few pluses was O’Connell – he looks a test certainty, probably alongside Shaw or Kay. A back row of Back-Corry-Moody is starting to look a real possibility too.

On showings so far Hodgson is the form Ten - and you have no idea how much that scares me!!! Hope Jonny comes through well on Wednesday.

[ravagon]

Originally posted by Havak

The Maoris had to get very 'creative' to assemble that side in the first place as well didn’t they - McDonald and Hollah etc are Maoris?

I'm sure I warned you about this. They weren't (quite) too Caucasian to qualify.
IIRC though you only need to be 1/16th part Maori. That pretty much rules out only the first generation since nationhood. Anybody else born within the last 120-odd years with any Maori blood whatsoever in the family tree is eligible.


Bizarrely (in some ways) I too hope Jonny makes it through Wednesday.

[Havak]

You did warn me.

Strangely I have just been discussing it with a Saints fan and a Moseley fan (they can't help it they were born in the areas concerned) and the Saints fan came out with a classic as we discussed the 1/16th thing:

"Yes well at least the Maoris are an NZ team - the ABs are the Pacific Island equivalents of the Lions".

I liked it anyway.

Where is Sitiveni Sivivatu from again?

[finbar]

Ah Havak! Nice to see you up and about for the day. I popped my head into the thread at around 9am my time. Not a sign of you. I thought you'd've been into work extra early keen to pore over the entrails of the match. Gee, hasn't Italy brought out the poet in me?

I've been having to count on the websites for info about the matches. Though, presumably, the BBC website will provide a broadcast of the Tests. With ADSL, I should be able to listen in.

[Havak]

9am your time? I'm parking up and dreaming of caffeine.

Is the beeb webcasting the matches? Normally webcast rights are domestic only where sport is concerned. More than that I am not sure the beeb even has UK rights to webcast these games.

Hmm, just checked the five live extra schedule - no webcast. Doesn't look like the world service is covering it either. Fingers crossed I am wrong.

[finbar]

Mmmm. I just checked too. I think you're right. The broadcasts aren't available online. Just endless broadcasts of the Australians smashing England off the park in the cricket. I'll have to hunt around elsewhere for a broadcast. I wonder if the Kiwis have discovered the wonders of the wireless yet ...

[finbar]

I spoke too soon. England won a silly 20/20 game. I saw one on TV before I left. A nonsensical game designed by marketers!