How will Canada keep warm now?!?

[notyoueither]

Originally posted by optimus2861

Bingo on both counts. Russia wasn't going to sign the thing at all until Putin did the math and realized he could make out like a bandit selling carbon-emissions credits to stupid countries like us who signed the thing without having a flip-flying clue how to actually implement it. (Thanks again, Jean Chretien, you asshat)

I can't wait to see the federal government try to justify sending hundreds of millions of taxpayer dollars to Russia for the sake of Kyoto, or what the environmental lobby in this country thinks about that precious treaty when that happens.

It could well be worse. The Fed would most likely require the polluting industries to pay the money overseas for the credits. Either that or tax them to make it up.

That may threaten to shut down some of or much of the tar sands developments that are planned or underway.

We did this once before. I'm really sure we don't want to go there again.

[Odin]

Originally posted by BlackCat


And the period of human existence are the right way to measure if current level are high or not ?

It seems that CO2 and temperature in the last 400.000 years follows a pattern and in current time we are reaching a peak in both :

http://arctic.unep.net/index.cfm?iss...=&data_id=9100

Ahhhh, the ice core CO2 data I was talking with Oerdin about about earlier in the thread.

[Geronimo]

Originally posted by Odin


Ahhhh, the ice core CO2 data I was talking with Oerdin about about earlier in the thread.

The unfortunate thing about that data is that it suggests that temperatures may be expected to spike sharply upward even in the absence of human activity. That means that should this increase in temperatures has unpleasant effects the increase will be seen as proof of anthogenic global warming and the effects will be blamed on the 'blindness' and selfishness of the the GW skeptics.

If only the past trend had suggested we were in for a period of cooling

[Ned]

Originally posted by My Wife Hates CIV
In the end... Canada and the others who signed this will continue to burn fuels for energy years from now just like they do today. Kyoto is not the solution. Something needs to be done... for sure we're messing this planet up. But humans have always been good at that. We're just REAL good at it now. and CO2 levels are at the lowest they have ever been if you look at the whole history of the earth - not just the last 80 years. i say go global warming - because when the ice comes back the planet can't support 7 billion people (it probably can't support that many now). and the ice will return.

Bingo. There is something very strange about the "global warming" debate. The studies show that agricultural capacity expands enormously in a warmer world. Particularly benefitted are Northern countries like the US, Canada, Europe and Russia. The new capacity certainly is needed to support an ever expanding population.

But the environmentalists are opposed to expanding population. They are also opposed to increasing the power of the Northern states at the expense of those to the South. Therefore, their opposition to global warming "could" be political.

[el freako]

Ned, you seem to be ignoring the huge costs that will be entailed by getting from here to there.

Such a shift of climate-ranges could only take place peacefully if there was only one political unit on the planet, as there are around 200 climate change is a recipe for war on a vast scale.

[Urban Ranger]

There is also this thing called disease. When temperature increases, tropical diseases are going to spread wider.

[Ned]

Originally posted by el freako
Ned, you seem to be ignoring the huge costs that will be entailed by getting from here to there.

Such a shift of climate-ranges could only take place peacefully if there was only one political unit on the planet, as there are around 200 climate change is a recipe for war on a vast scale.

el freako, I think the recipe for war is in the Kyoto protocol. Forcing some countries to cut back their industry while letting others off the hook when the countries that are cutting back are the main beneficiaries of warmer temperatures is fundamentally unfair. Sometime or the other, some prominent politician is going to start talking about the "real" objectives of the promoters of Kyoto. The world will then divide on the issue. War is a possibility as the proponents of radical change, Europe, increasing made demands on the US and others that are wholly unacceptable.

[Ned]

Originally posted by Urban Ranger
There is also this thing called disease. When temperature increases, tropical diseases are going to spread wider.

Food vs. Fever. Let's vote.

[notyoueither]

It's only temporary. Ned. Then we end up with glaciers that stop somewhere south of Kansas.

Real estate investments aren't advisable unless you sell at the right time.

[Ned]

NYE, reminds me of the Superman movie where Lex Luther was buying up "beachfront" property in Nevada and plotting to drop California into the Pacific with a manufactured earthquake.