MARRUECOS - Final version available!

[Case]

Wow, this is a terrific scenario Pablostuka! Congratulations.

[Pablostuka]

@POTUS: Ok, thanks. Interesting one. Let's see who wins

@Case: Thanks!

[curtsibling]

Stried this epic today.

Seriously good stuff!

[Art of War]

Two things that could be corrected in the scenario...

1) The AV-8B Harrier should be the EAV-8B Matador....it is the spanish version of the harrier.

2) Wouldn't the US be forced to help...especially with Spain's support in Gulf War 2 of 2003?

[POTUS]

Well, as far as I know, the war is very unpopular in Spain, and according to the New York Times, a very leftist party (can't remember the name) will almost certainly win the next election. So, say that they took Spain out of Iraq, and in revenge, Gephardt is using this as an opportunity to get revenge on Spain, and get some new contracts for the US.

[Art of War]

it'll be bush again...

[POTUS]

Not if I can help it.

[Case]

Pablostuka, here are a couple of sugestions:

1) limit the amount of stuff helicopters and transport aircraft can carry to one unit or reduce the numbers present in the scenario. At the moment it's way too easy to move the entire Spanish Army across the strait of Gibraltar. For reference, a C-130 can carry a single AFV or a company of infantry and a Puma chopper can carry either a squad of infantry or a single artillery gun and it's crew. Airlifting two or three battalions per tern should be the limit of Spain's air transport capacity. BTW, AFAIK, nothing in Spain's air inventory can carry tanks - there should be a house rule requireing that these be moved by sea.

2) On the topic of the entire Spanish Army, are you sure that it all needs to be included in the scenario? The scenario would be more balanced if the only units opposing the Morrocans were the rapid deployment forces (the Paras, Marines and the Spanish Rapid Deployment Division). In the real world, it takes anywhere from a week to a month for 'heavy' units to be ready to move out from their barracks, and the scenario would be better if this was included - especially as you're assuming that the Morrocans achieve near total suprise.


On the topic of US involvement, any Morocan attack on Spanish territory would satisfy the terms of the NATO treaty ('an attack on one is an attack on all'). Of course, the other countries may be embarresed at helping Spain protect the last vestiges of it's empire. Given the situation between Britain and Spain over Gibraltar, Britain may also get involved on Spain's side, just to make a point about the legitimacy of having small enclaves in other countries territory [though Blair does seem to be strangely keen to surrender Gibralter to Spain]

There's a British light infantry battalion based at Gibraltar (the Royal Gibraltar Regiment) and there are usually some RN ships nearby. The 16th Air Assault Brigade could rapidly be flown in, and a battalion of Royal Marines could quickly be brought in by sea within a couple of weeks.

[POTUS]

Not to be nit-picky, but also, Ceuta only has a beach 25 m long. That is the only 25 m on the island where an amphibious attack is possible. Imagine just a company entrenched to defend a 25 m strip. And with mines, it is overkill.

[Pablostuka]

Originally posted by Case
Pablostuka, here are a couple of sugestions:

1) limit the amount of stuff helicopters and transport aircraft can carry to one unit or reduce the numbers present in the scenario. At the moment it's way too easy to move the entire Spanish Army across the strait of Gibraltar. For reference, a C-130 can carry a single AFV or a company of infantry and a Puma chopper can carry either a squad of infantry or a single artillery gun and it's crew. Airlifting two or three battalions per tern should be the limit of Spain's air transport capacity. BTW, AFAIK, nothing in Spain's air inventory can carry tanks - there should be a house rule requireing that these be moved by sea.

I know. But I had to risk realism for playability. I had strong headaches due to this topic, but my playtesters and I decided to let the airplanes to carry any kind of unit.

Initially, the helicopters only carried infantry (same as now), and the airplanes only infantry or light vehicles. But the playability was reduced a lot, ad the game became very boring...

Our air inventory of CASA C.212, CASA CN-235, CASA C-295 and Lockheed C-130 Hercules doesn't let us to carry our tanks, but let's see when the Airbus A-400M arrives...

2) On the topic of the entire Spanish Army, are you sure that it all needs to be included in the scenario? The scenario would be more balanced if the only units opposing the Morrocans were the rapid deployment forces (the Paras, Marines and the Spanish Rapid Deployment Division). In the real world, it takes anywhere from a week to a month for 'heavy' units to be ready to move out from their barracks, and the scenario would be better if this was included - especially as you're assuming that the Morrocans achieve near total suprise.

Well...I included the entire 2 armies (Spanish and Moroccan). What's the advantage to fight the entire Moroccan army with only the fast deployment units? Of course we'd win, but the I can't show you guys how looks our Armed Forces . More or less these are the numbers, and the Spanish units are in their actual bases.

It takes a few turns to mobilise them. The turns that the Moroccans need to secure the captured areas to prevent any Spanish counterattack.

On the topic of US involvement, any Morocan attack on Spanish territory would satisfy the terms of the NATO treaty ('an attack on one is an attack on all').

That only would apply to the Canary Islands. For some weird reason Ceuta and Melilla are not under NATO protection

And the same fact: Playability. If I include NATO forces in the scen, the Moroccans won't have a chance for surviving.

I am a 100% realism guy, but I had to 'behave' in this one to satisfy the players

There's a British light infantry battalion based at Gibraltar (the Royal Gibraltar Regiment) and there are usually some RN ships nearby. The 16th Air Assault Brigade could rapidly be flown in, and a battalion of Royal Marines could quickly be brought in by sea within a couple of weeks.

Yeah, I know. I have been in Gibraltar. I took some photos of these Tornado fighters

Aniway, I hope you enjoy the scen

And remember...it's not realism, it's playability

[Pablostuka]

Originally posted by Art of War
Two things that could be corrected in the scenario...

1) The AV-8B Harrier should be the EAV-8B Matador....it is the spanish version of the harrier.

Actually, our Harriers are bought to the USA, and modified (improved) in Spain. I know the designation is 'Matador' (Killer) but our pilots still call them 'Harriers'.

The designation is AV-8B+ Harrier Plus 'Matador'. But too long for a Civ2 scenario

2) Wouldn't the US be forced to help...especially with Spain's support in Gulf War 2 of 2003?

Explained above

[Case]

Originally posted by Pablostuka
Well...I included the entire 2 armies (Spanish and Moroccan). What's the advantage to fight the entire Moroccan army with only the fast deployment units?

It would be both more realistic and more challanging.

I can't show you guys how looks our Armed Forces

I can - there's a modern TO&E at: www.orbat.com/site/toe/index.html and an OOB circa 1989 at https://www.tdg.nu/resources/TOE/OOB...es_modern.html If you're willing to fork out US $50, the current Spanish OOB is available at www.orbat.com (and it's a very nice piece of work).

More or less these are the numbers, and the Spanish units are in their actual bases.

Yep - you've done a great job

It takes a few turns to mobilise them. The turns that the Moroccans need to secure the captured areas to prevent any Spanish counterattack.

Good point.

That only would apply to the Canary Islands. For some weird reason Ceuta and Melilla are not under NATO protection

How odd. I didn't know that.

And the same fact: Playability. If I include NATO forces in the scen, the Moroccans won't have a chance for surviving.

Yeah, fair enough.

Aniway, I hope you enjoy the scen

I most certainly am enjoying it. It's lots of fun.

[Pablostuka]

Thanks for the comments

[POTUS]

Technically, Ceuta and Melilla are colonial possesions and, therefore are not protected by NATO. However, the Canary Islands, being islands in the North Atlantic are considered island possesions, besides hosting many strategic bases for the USN and USAF.

[our_man]

Another excellent scenario Pablostuka! My brother isn't much of a scenario fan (preferring vanilla Civ) but I managed to rope him into playing me in a game.

With only 10 turns, it's short and sweet, a definite bonus!

Any chance of a single player version also?