Punishing the majority for the actions of the minority

[Jules]

No link yet as this was just on my local television news.

But apparently there was some mayhem here in East Lansing in response to Sunday's loss by the MSU Spartans in the NCAA Men's Basketball Tournament.

So now, some conservative state lawmakers want to further cut the university's budget for next year in response to this incident. This on top of an already sizeable 6.5% cut in funding.

There are over 30,000 students at MSU, me included. Only about 2,000 of them participated in this weekend's rioting (and how much you wanna bet many of those weren't even college students? ). I was not one of them.

Discuss why the majority should be punished for the actions of a minority.

[Spiffor]

Because it's easier to blame everybody without targetting the culprits first ?
Because there is a general trend to reduce funding to anything in the US, and any excuse if good ?

[Jules]

Re: Punishing the majority for the actions of the minority

Originally posted by Jules
Discuss why the majority should be punished for the actions of a minority.

Or why they shouldn't be, which is my preference.

[MRT144]

good, hopefully they will eliminate MSU football too so they can no longer sieze OSU national championships from OSU.

next stop, the big M

[Japher]

Can't argue that. The majority should not be punished by the deeds of the few. It is most likely just an excuse to pinch a penny, hopefully they will make the cuts at the expense of the athelitic departments, and not at the educational departments.

[Jules]

Considering that the athletics program actually generates revenue for the university, I rather doubt it will be cut. Right now I'm worried about departmental funding for next year. Obviously I have to pass my prelims in May before I'm eligible for that, but I'm really gonna need that tuition waiver with how high out-of-state rates are.

[Worthingtons]

It's done to kill two birds in one stone, the lack of a need to investigate the true culprits (thus reducing expendature in time/resuorces) and amazingly as a 'guilt' tactic - the one's responsable will be guilty that others have suffered and will not re-offend is the idea, but this rarely actually works in practise.

[OneFootInTheGrave]

The leading elite - or the state people in this case try to find a good reason to do what they want - when any theoretically acceptable reason appears they present it and do what they wanted for a while.

This is the benefit of developed society - at least they have to wait for some kind of a reason to do what they wanted all along

[Jules]

Officials are now offering rewards for anyone who can help them to identify participants.

'U' officials offer up to $2,500 for riot information

By KELLI CYNECKI

The State News

University and East Lansing officials are offering up to $2,500 for information leading to the arrest and conviction of participants in Sunday night's riot that shook campus and the city's downtown.

MSU President M. Peter McPherson said those caught participating in illegal activities will be "aggressively punished."

University officials said the monetary source of the award hasn't been determined, but costs will be shared with the city, McPherson said.

"We will and are asking the media for the tapes which they actually ran on TV," MSU police Chief Jim Dunlap said. "We have our own video between the two departments that we will be reviewing.

"We're asking for any citizen that took tape or still photos to please turn those in to the police department."

A student participating in the disturbances also could be punished under MSU's judiciary process, which could lead to removal from the university.

After the March 27-28, 1999 riot, the university created a Web site with pictures of the disturbances. The hope was that viewers would identify riot participants.

"The pictures on the Web were a huge help," McPherson said. The riot resulted in 132 arrests, but officials didn't know how many were a result of the Web site.

"Students will be removed from school," McPherson said. "If the facts show that these types of acts were done by students, then the riot policy will be applied and we will aggressively follow it."

The Student Disorderly Conduct Policy states officials cannot discipline students until a verdict is reached through the campus judiciary system. University officials retain the right to suspend students who present a "clear and present danger" to people or property.

The current policy allows students to be punished on MSU's campus, areas near MSU and other college campuses.

By strongly enforcing this policy, McPherson said future disturbances will be deterred.

Anthropology senior W. Qosmon Sagataw, a student during the 1999 riot, said she remembers the university successfully punishing those who participated.

But she doesn't believe university officials should be worried about the image of the university as a whole.

"I don't think it's more important to worry about image than to worry about classes," Sagataw said.

But Trustee Colleen McNamara said a negative image of the school affects the university's educational values.

"This kind of behavior undermines our higher educational goals," she said. "I'm just kind of sick of it.

"Were not the only university that this is happening to and we aren't the only university that this is happening to in the state - I don't quite understand it."

MSU's Vice President for Finance and Operations Fred Poston said the riot policy is not an unusual policy for universities to have, adding other schools also have strict codes of conduct.

"There has been education for the past four years about it," he said.

"But we haven't had an occasion to apply it."

But the riots shouldn't be the main university priority, no-preference freshman Adam Sanborn said. These disturbances only occur in very limited cases and don't reflect the student body as a whole, he added.

"They've been pretty good about disciplining people," he said. "But I don't think the university necessarily needs to worry about it all the time."

Sanborn said the monetary reward will be enticing to students and anyone with information will probably turn someone in.

"I don't think anyone's going to sell their friends out," he said. "But at the same time, people might think twice and worry about their friends selling them out."

Police are asking anyone with information on Sunday night's riot to call (517)353-3169.

Staff writers Aaron Foley and Chad Previch contributed to this report.

[Berzerker]

Discuss why the majority should be punished for the actions of a minority.

Same premise as the drug war, punish millions of drug users who don't run around committing acts of mayhem because of the small minority who do.

[MRT144]

thats a good analogy berzerker...but does that make it right?

[Berzerker]

Nope.

[Guynemer]

I haven't heard a word about this... I smell an April Fool's joke.

Though it certainly would be in keeping with MSU's history...

[red_jon]

If this happened to me, I would be outraged. Sports already take too high a priority in academia - now the entire university gets punished because of the sports fans?

[Jules]

Finally, some press on this issue:

Chaos not likely to cause state funding cuts
Lawmakers want strict discipline for participants

By JOEY GUILLEN

The State News

State lawmakers say they are "disgusted" by Sunday's riot, but it is unlikely the chaos will result in a drop-off in state money for MSU.
Months before Sunday's mayhem, House Speaker Rick Johnson recreated a higher education policy committee because he's "sick and tired of watching university kids tear university campuses apart."

With taxpayers spending about $1.5 billion on state universities, Johnson, R-LeRoy, said students "ought to behave."

But even in the face of Sunday's riot - which caused about $40,000 in damage to campus - Johnson spokeswoman Emily Gerkin said student behavior won't play a major role in funding decisions.

"The state is spending so much money to help these kids with their education," Gerkin said. "This is the behavior they show - because a basketball game was lost."

Although Johnson realizes a small percentage of MSU students participated in the riot, he also recognizes the stain it puts on MSU's reputation, Gerkin said.

Rep. Virg Bernero, D-Lansing, said Sunday's riot could set back the fight to save higher education funding. Legislators who aren't from the Lansing area have a hard time understanding the riot isn't an accurate reflection of the MSU community, he said.

"For whom higher education is not a priority, this gives them one more hook to hang a 'no' vote on," he said. "You don't want the legislators, when they hear MSU, to be thinking 'riot.'

"That's why it's important for the university to show that they're going to get tough with those that get caught. That's going to be important."

University spokesman Terry Denbow said it's fair for legislators to monitor punishments university officials hand out to students involved in the riot.

"Accountability is at the heart of a land grant university," he said. "That's our strength. Our record is built on accountability to the taxpayers of Michigan."

Denbow said he's confident state lawmakers will keep the riot in proper perspective.

"The action of a few do not make a university's reputation," he said. "These aren't the students that represent the values and overall image of our students."

After meeting with two legislators Wednesday, ASMSU Academic Assembly Chairperson Matt Clayson said he shares Denbow's confidence.

"They didn't even bring (the riot) up," he said. "It shows they understand that the majority of Michigan State students were not involved."

Bill Ballenger, editor and publisher of the Lansing-based newsletter Inside Michigan Politics, said he can't remember the state reducing any of its expenditures because of a disturbance such as Sunday's riot.

"Every time something like this happens, (legislators) claim they're going to take it out on the university," he said. "When it gets right down to it, they don't."


Joey Guillen can be reached at guillenj@msu.edu.