Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

Antiterror bill meets opposition

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • Antiterror bill meets opposition

    SALEM -- A bill that would define violent protesters as terrorists and subject them to possible life imprisonment came under attack Monday at a packed and sometimes tense legislative hearing.

    Antiwar activists and civil libertarians showed up in force to criticize Senate Bill 742, which they said contains overly broad language and gives police expanded powers to investigate people based on ethnicity.

    "We are living in the McCarthy era all over again," said Patty Caldwell, an antiwar activist from Welches. "Then, you were called a communist. Now, you're called a terrorist sympathizer."

    The statements came during the bill's first hearing in the Senate Judiciary Committee. Committee Chairman Sen. John Minnis, R-Wood Village, author of the bill, threatened to clear the hearing room after repeated bursts of applause for speakers and interruptions shouted from the audience.

    Minnis said he introduced the measure to put all crimes that could be construed as terrorism into a single law with tough punishment guidelines, and to require Oregon police agencies to cooperate with federal investigations into terrorists.

    But the wording of the bill left many concerned that it could be applied to relatively minor acts of vandalism or misbehavior during a demonstration. The bill applies to acts of violence committed while someone is disrupting commerce, transportation, schools or universities.

    Anyone convicted of terrorism would get an automatic life sentence with a 25-year minimum before being considered for parole.

    "Many of the protesters arrested last week in Portland for misdemeanor conduct may have qualified for prosecution" under SB 742, said Susan Russell of the Oregon Criminal Lawyers Association. Crimes, such as throwing a rock through a window, or lighting flags on fire while demonstrating, do not warrant potential life sentences, she said.

    After the hearing, the judiciary committee's three Democratic members spoke against the bill, all but killing its chances of surviving intact. All Senate committees are divided equally between Democrats and Republicans, and a bill must get a majority of committee votes to move forward.

    "This bill chips away at the very freedom we profess to enjoy in the face of terrorism," said Sen. Charlie Ringo, D-Beaverton. "I would not want our servicemen in the Middle East and elsewhere to return and find that the freedoms they are risking their lives for overseas have been damaged while entrusted to the care of the Oregon Senate."

    Sen. Ted Ferrioli of John Day, one of three Republicans on the committee, said Oregon law needs to be changed to more clearly define acts of civil disobedience and acts of terrorism. But two other Democrats on the committee, Vicki Walker of Eugene and Ginny Burdick of Portland, said they won't support the bill.

    Minnis said he will rewrite portions of the bill in an attempt to address concerns about the broad language and role Oregon police agencies would have in federal terror investigations. No additional hearings have been scheduled on the bill.

    "Unfortunately, there's a lot of hysteria associated with some of the original language" of the bill, he said. "I will bring something back and see if it works."



    The relevent portion of the law:
    (1) A person commits the crime of terrorism if
    the person knowingly plans, participates in or carries out any act that is intended, by at least one of its participants, to disrupt:
    (a) The free and orderly assembly of the inhabitants of the State of Oregon;
    (b) Commerce or the transportation systems of the State of Oregon; or
    (c) The educational or governmental institutions of the State of Oregon or its inhabitants.


    So what do you think of the law? Does it overly extend the definition of terrorism? Or is it a needed measure to clamp down on protests of the type that gripped San Francisco?
    I make no bones about my moral support for [terrorist] organizations. - chegitz guevara
    For those who aspire to live in a high cost, high tax, big government place, our nation and the world offers plenty of options. Vermont, Canada and Venezuela all offer you the opportunity to live in the socialist, big government paradise you long for. –Senator Rubio

  • #2
    If you cant deal with the consequences of a war (ie protests) then dont support/declare war.
    "Everything for the State, nothing against the State, nothing outside the State" - Benito Mussolini

    Comment


    • #3
      Originally posted by Lawrence of Arabia
      If you cant deal with the consequences of a war (ie protests) then dont support/declare war.
      People are too scared where I live to stand in the middle of the street, so I can deal with it just fine.
      I make no bones about my moral support for [terrorist] organizations. - chegitz guevara
      For those who aspire to live in a high cost, high tax, big government place, our nation and the world offers plenty of options. Vermont, Canada and Venezuela all offer you the opportunity to live in the socialist, big government paradise you long for. –Senator Rubio

      Comment


      • #4
        Demonstrations = terrorism?

        I can see a backlash against the Republicans is coming.
        (\__/) 07/07/1937 - Never forget
        (='.'=) "Claims demand evidence; extraordinary claims demand extraordinary evidence." -- Carl Sagan
        (")_(") "Starting the fire from within."

        Comment


        • #5
          I think that bill is going much too far. If the protesters are destructive assholes, arrest them and charge them with the usual - disorderly conduct, vandalism, assault, etc. You can change existing laws to make punishments greater for, say, deliberately impeding traffic, etc. But automatic life? 25-year minimum? Ridiculous.

          Comment


          • #6
            That law is quite literally the stupidest thing I've read today.

            Thank you DD.
            12-17-10 Mohamed Bouazizi NEVER FORGET
            Stadtluft Macht Frei
            Killing it is the new killing it
            Ultima Ratio Regum

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by Frogger
              Thank you DD.
              Glad to be of service.
              I make no bones about my moral support for [terrorist] organizations. - chegitz guevara
              For those who aspire to live in a high cost, high tax, big government place, our nation and the world offers plenty of options. Vermont, Canada and Venezuela all offer you the opportunity to live in the socialist, big government paradise you long for. –Senator Rubio

              Comment


              • #8
                The law is so vague as to invite abuse. I can't see how such a law would ever survive the inevitable appeals its passage would bring, so why waste the public's time with it?

                Life in prison (or 25 years) for blocking trafic is beyond absurd. Thank God such laws did not exist back in the days of the fight agaisnt segregation.
                If you don't like reality, change it! me
                "Oh no! I am bested!" Drake
                "it is dangerous to be right when the government is wrong" Voltaire
                "Patriotism is a pernecious, psychopathic form of idiocy" George Bernard Shaw

                Comment


                • #9
                  Terrorism is using violence for political means. This bill would only target violent demonstrators.
                  "I'm moving to the Left" - Lancer

                  "I imagine the neighbors on your right are estatic." - Slowwhand

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    There is no qualification for violence. As Dino pointed out:

                    (1) A person commits the crime of terrorism if
                    the person knowingly plans, participates in or carries out any act that is intended, by at least one of its participants, to disrupt:
                    (a) The free and orderly assembly of the inhabitants of the State of Oregon;
                    (b) Commerce or the transportation systems of the State of Oregon; or
                    (c) The educational or governmental institutions of the State of Oregon or its inhabitants.
                    And even if there were, life imprisonment for vaguely defined "violence" would hardly be justified.
                    "Beware of the man who works hard to learn something, learns it, and finds himself no wiser than before. He is full of murderous resentment of people who are ignorant without having come by their ignorance the hard way. "
                    -Bokonon

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      No, it would target people who 'obstruct the free and orderly assembly', or in other words whoever the cops don't like.
                      "Wait a minute..this isn''t FAUX dive, it's just a DIVE!"
                      "...Mangy dog staggering about, looking vainly for a place to die."
                      "sauna stories? There are no 'sauna stories'.. I mean.. sauna is sauna. You do by the laws of sauna." -P.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Isn't that law what's on the books "public disruption" or the like?

                        It's one of those laws that are enacted to give the police wide discretionary powers. But nuisance charges don't usually carry a 25 year penalty.

                        It's ****ing insane...
                        12-17-10 Mohamed Bouazizi NEVER FORGET
                        Stadtluft Macht Frei
                        Killing it is the new killing it
                        Ultima Ratio Regum

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          It's apt that the law was proposed in a city named Salem...
                          "Beware of the man who works hard to learn something, learns it, and finds himself no wiser than before. He is full of murderous resentment of people who are ignorant without having come by their ignorance the hard way. "
                          -Bokonon

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by Shi Huangdi
                            Terrorism is using violence for political means. This bill would only target violent demonstrators.
                            Even if it did, violent demonstration does not merit 25 years to life in prison. Any crimes commited during a protest, such as vandalism, assualting an officer, resisting arrest and so forth are already covered by current laws and can be more than adequatey prosecuted. There is no need for such a law, and this propsed wording is so vague as to be absurd. And again, it would never survive appeals.
                            If you don't like reality, change it! me
                            "Oh no! I am bested!" Drake
                            "it is dangerous to be right when the government is wrong" Voltaire
                            "Patriotism is a pernecious, psychopathic form of idiocy" George Bernard Shaw

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              The "disrupt" part can be extremely broadly interpreted, so that even jaywalking can be viewed as disrupting traffic.
                              (\__/) 07/07/1937 - Never forget
                              (='.'=) "Claims demand evidence; extraordinary claims demand extraordinary evidence." -- Carl Sagan
                              (")_(") "Starting the fire from within."

                              Comment

                              Working...
                              X