Ayn Rand

[DuncanK]

Good stuff. Keep it up, what ever it takes

[DuncanK]

Originally posted by Richard Bruns
Maybe it is something we can evolve into in a few hundred years, but in the meantime democracy and capitalism are the best way of providing for the needs of people.

How are we going to evolve when we are taught to be selfish and exploitive? We would have to teach future generations to be unselfish and not to exploit others, and if we do that we can't justify capitalism.

[Berzerker]

Ramo -

I find it amusing that the ultra-liberals who want things like slavery reperations are just enforcing legitimate capitalist property rights, while the ultra-capitalists are so vehemently opposed to it.

Huh? Liberals are trying to find a justification to increase the welfare state to benefit blacks. But how does opposing slave "reparations" constitute hypocrisy (the source of your amusement) on the part of "utlra-capitalists"? Are ultra-capitalists required by capitalism to pay for the sins of the dead?
And how are these liberals enforcing legitimate property rights by handing one group of people money belonging to another group?

[DuncanK]

I guess there wouldn't be any interest in teaching our children not to be self-interested when their survival depends on it. That's my point. Evolution is not possible. People have to be reeducated, and that has to come from a society (authority) which sees an interest in such education.

[DuncanK]

Originally posted by Berzerker
Are ultra-capitalists required by capitalism to pay for the sins of the dead?

You want people to inherit property from their ancestors, but not the debt of their ancestors.

Don't get me wrong. I'm against the reparations. I'm just pointing out the hypocracy in your judgement.

edit: changed decendants to ancestors

[Berzerker]

Duncan -

You want people to inherit property from their ancestors, but not the debt of their ancestors.

Where did you get the idea reparations are about inherited debt?
Reparations are about taking money from one group of people and handing it to another regardless of whether or not the first group's ancestors owned slaves. Many people had ancestors die in the Civil War, how about the descendents of slaves paying them a debt? Btw, before one can inherit money, the original owner's estate has to cover outstanding debts, but no one should be legally bound to cover that debt should the estate lack the wealth to cover it.

Don't get me wrong. I'm against the reparations.

Why?

I'm just pointing out the hypocracy in your judgement.

Then you'll have to do better than that.

[Andemagne]

is Ayn Rand even a Real Philosopher, 'cos I can't find her from my Cambrudge Dictonary of Philosophy?

[Agathon]

Originally posted by Andemagne
is Ayn Rand even a Real Philosopher, 'cos I can't find her from my Cambrudge Dictonary of Philosophy?

No she isn't. She's a sort of popular "philosopher" who sells a lot of books due to her support for capitalism and ethical egoism. She's to philosophy what the "Men are from Mars" guy is to psychology.

Professional philosophers don't think much of her because she doesn't argue very well and her doctrines basically ignore counterarguments from the last 100 years of ethical theory. Of course her adherents claim this is some sort of left wing conspiracy when the truth is that she's c**p. After all you'll probably find Robert Nozick in your book - a man of similar views to Ms Rand but a much better philosopher.

I was going to write a longer post detailing exactly what is wrong with her doctrines, but this thread has not really got anywhere so I don't see much point.

[Agathon]

Originally posted by Imran Siddiqui
Actually it is. Revenge is the purest form of 'justice'.

Prove it or shut up.

[Andemagne]

roger that. I am familiar with Mr. Nozick.

[Agathon]

Originally posted by Andemagne
roger that. I am familiar with Mr. Nozick.

A great philosopher was he. I was saddened to hear of his death. He's an example of someone on the right who knows the value of good arguments.

[DuncanK]

Originally posted by Berzerker
Duncan -

Where did you get the idea reparations are about inherited debt?
Reparations are about taking money from one group of people and handing it to another regardless of whether or not the first group's ancestors owned slaves. Many people had ancestors die in the Civil War, how about the descendents of slaves paying them a debt? Btw, before one can inherit money, the original owner's estate has to cover outstanding debts, but no one should be legally bound to cover that debt should the estate lack the wealth to cover it.



Why?



Then you'll have to do better than that.

I don't support the reparations, but I am in favor of a single wealth tax.

[DinoDoc]

Originally posted by Ramo
That's the whole point. I don't. My philosophy doesn't have to deal with that baggage. It is a problem for the conception of capitalist property rights, though

I'm siezing your computer Ramo! It was obtained with wealth madevthrough exploitation of the masses!

[Berzerker]

Duncan - You didn't explain why you oppose reparations.

Agathon -

I was going to write a longer post detailing exactly what is wrong with her doctrines, but this thread has not really got anywhere so I don't see much point.

You've finally learned your best arguments are the one's you don't post.

[DuncanK]

Originally posted by Berzerker
Duncan - You didn't explain why you oppose reparations.

The same reason you do.