I Kinda Like this Guy

[Comrade Tribune]

Originally posted by Jon Miller
I alway thought that some of it was the shame of persecution for ~2000 years

Jon Miller

Is that the kind of history now thought at American schools? That the Catholic Church persecuted Jews for 2000 years, uninterruptedly? (Protestants were not even around for most of the time, so they couldn´t persecute anybody.)

Catholic Church and Jews most of the time peacefully co-existed. The ones persecuted were Heretics; but you had to be Christian to be a Heretic.

[Dinner]

According to Catholic views for most of the church's history Jews were considered heretics because they denied the divine origin of Jesus. Enforcement was sporadic but the rulings are there.

[Comrade Tribune]

Originally posted by Oerdin
According to Catholic views for most of the church's history Jews were considered heretics because they denied the divine origin of Jesus.

No. A Heretic had to be a Christian. Pagans weren´t considered Heretics, neither were Jews.

Muslims recognize Christ, so they were in somewhat of a grey zone, as to their Heretic status.

[Jon Miller]

Originally posted by Comrade Tribune


Is that the kind of history now thought at American schools? That the Catholic Church persecuted Jews for 2000 years, uninterruptedly? (Protestants were not even around for most of the time, so they couldn´t persecute anybody.)

Catholic Church and Jews most of the time peacefully co-existed. The ones persecuted were Heretics; but you had to be Christian to be a Heretic.

which college did you go to?

Jon Miller

[Comrade Tribune]

Originally posted by Jon Miller
which college did you go to?

Hard as it may seem for you to believe, the persecution of Jews was not what most of history was about.

Though Jews have, indeed, been sometimes assaulted by the crowd, occasionally by the State, only *very* rarely by the Church.

[Jon Miller]

and especially by a lot of european states, and european crowds...



Jon Miller

[Boris Godunov]

Originally posted by Jon Miller
and especially by a lot of european states, and european crowds...



Jon Miller

Where, outside of Europe and the Mediterranean, was one to find large numbers of Jews between 1 - 1500 AD?

[Jon Miller]

be quiet, this is for Tribune

Jon Miller

[Comrade Tribune]

Originally posted by Boris Godunov
Where, outside of Europe and the Mediterranean, was one to find large numbers of Jews between 1 - 1500 AD?

Just wanted to comment on the weak point in Jon´s Europe bashing, but you were faster.

[chequita guevara]

Actually, for most of the Church's history, it has been persecuting Jews somewhere. The Spanish Catholics have always had something against the Jews since the time that the Goths converted from Arianism. The Eastern Roman Empire persecuted Jews to the point that the Jews sided with Persia. Christian Ethioppia conquered and massacred Jewish Yemen. Before each crusade, Jews would be massacred in Germany. And it only got worse when Protestantism came on the scene. Christians have only been nice to Jews for the last fifty years, and it seems to have been only skin deep.

obiwan18, I am always amused at how Christians think they have to explain Christianity to ex-Christians. Most of Christianity aren't like thw whack jobs of the extreme right. These people believe the end times are now, that in order for the end times to come about, Israel must become Christian, and that in order for this to happen, Israel has to exist (and therefore must be defended). Fortunately, this represents a minority in Christian and even Protestant thinking.

[Jon Miller]

Originally posted by Comrade Tribune


Just wanted to comment on the weak point in Jon´s Europe bashing, but you were faster.

weren't their some african jews?

Jon Miller

[Boris Godunov]

Originally posted by chegitz guevara
Fortunately, this represents a minority in Christian and even Protestant thinking.

Unfortunately, it also seems to represent a significant number of policy makers within the Bush White House, including John Asscroft.

[Comrade Tribune]

Originally posted by chegitz guevara
Fortunately, this represents a minority in Christian and even Protestant thinking.

This is true.

As to anti-Jewish events, those were mostly state- or crowd-sponsored, as I said. The Church itself very rarely participated.

Back to the present: The Pope has made it quite clear that, from a Christian viewpoint, this is *not* a just war. For a Protestant American Church sharing the same opinion (with quite an amount of vitriol added ), look here:

http://www.endtimesnetwork.com/index.html

They *do* believe that the end times are near, but they also believe that the US Empire is the Whore of Babylon.

[chequita guevara]

Originally posted by Jon Miller
weren't their some african jews?

Jon Miller

Yep. There were a group of Jews in Ethiopia, who even took power for a short time before Nubia invaded and toppled them (they were led by a woman named Judath the Fire). A group of Yemeni Jews emigrated to Southern Africa and established the trading city that is today called Great Zimbabwe. Their ancestors still live in the region and are known as the Lemba people.

[chequita guevara]

Originally posted by Comrade Tribune
They *do* believe that the end times are near, but they also believe that the US Empire is the Whore of Babylon.

Many believe that the US is God's instrument on Earth.