Do we really want Democracy?

[Imran Siddiqui]

Inspired by a Sava quote that 70% (or something) that support the war on Iraq are beer-swilling NASCAR fans (or something).

The question is do we really want democracy? And if we do, does it make sense to say that the people are wrong? After all, if we really believe in democracy, wouldn't we end up saying the people are right?

Of course, there is a high percentage of people who aren't as educated as, say, the people on this site (and yes, we all are educated). Do we want the same power given to these people as we want given to our scientists and doctors? By some peoples' comments (the people are sheep... morons... etc), it seems we may have some problems.

So what can we do? Is it simply like Churchill says? (Paraphrasing) Democracy is the worst form of government, except when compared to the rest of them?

[JohnT]

It is odd how the very people who decry the "masses" just love showing how they have popular support in their attempt to stop the war. "Our protest was attended by millions!"

[SlowwHand]

People=Democracy, and yes, we want it.
Che, David, and Sava can go to Cuba.

[Imran Siddiqui]

Heh, though I think both sides are guilty of it, John.

There is definte tension between the 'unwashed masses' and the 'intellectual elites' on both sides! The elites think they should run the country, but also believe the people should have a say. But when the people have their say, the elites say the people are easily manipulated. It's an interesting conundrum and circle.

[Richelieu]

We, some of the people of the United States, in order to form a more perfect union, establish justice for the more fortunate, insure domestic tranquility for the same people, provide for the common defense of our oil fields in IRAQ, promote the general welfare of the HMOs, and secure the blessings of liberty to ourselves and our posterity (excluding some people), do ordain and establish this Constitution for the United States of America.

[Arrian]

Dictatorship = bad
Mob rule = also bad

So we try to strike a balance... and get a representative republic.

Politicians will forever claim that the people are with them, or if not, that the people have been manipulated (I think the political buzzterm is "the politics of fear" when you want to claim that your opponent is manipulative).

It beats the hell out of tyranny. To improve it, we need to work on education. The better educated the masses are, the better their decision making will be (that's the theory anyway, and I think it's sound).

-Arrian

[Japher]

beer-swilling NASCAR fans

That's me!

First, I don't like how you seem to ellude that such people are uneducated. I can see how one might think that, as all we are watching are some very powerful cars going around a track. I like to call it a "left-turn competition". Yet, until one goes to a NASCAR race it can never be truly appreciated. I like it, and I am smart... At least I think I am.

Second, I agree with Churchill.

Third, if you want a democracy you have to listen to the voice of the meek, the small, and the insignificant. It is them who will inherit the world. It is them who make democracy worth fighting for. It is them who make the governemt as strong as it is. The real problem lies in those who think they are smart, those who hold power, and those who believe they know what is fair, righ, and democratic. I would rather have the bottom wrung dictating what to do for a time.

Hey, for once I agree with the French:

I have come to the conclusions that politics are too serious a matter to be left to the politicians.
--Charles De Gaulle

Patriotism is when love of your own people comes first; nationalism, when hate for people other than your own comes first.
--Charles De Gaulle

[Richelieu]

Is there such a thing as an enlightened despot ? If Saddam, instead of being a tyrant, actually cared for his people and instigated policies that profited his people, would that be enough to leave him be ? Would the revolution be worth the freedom ?

[SlowwHand]

If. If a frog had wings, it wouldn't whomp it's ass every time it jumped.

[DuncanK]

I'm not a fan of American democracy. And I surely don't believe that important decisions should be left to the masses to make. American society is already elitest. The capitalists have great power to make things happen in their benefit. If we created an elitest society based on educated people (not money) this elite class would still act mainly in their own interest as opposed to everyone's interest, although they probably would do a better job. That could be worse. These people are smarter so they could exploit us better

[Caligastia]

Benevolent dictatorship is the best form of government.

[Eli]

The best leader we can have is a leader like ourselves when playing civ. Someone whose goal is truly the well-being of the nation.

The only one who can do it is, of course, me.

[SlowwHand]

Oh, man. Is that another veiled joke, Cal ?
Youe humor is as dry as the Texas sand, so it's hard to tell.

[Boris Godunov]

Originally posted by Caligastia
Benevolent dictatorship is the best form of government.

That depends on to whom he is benevolent.

[Inverse Icarus]

true democracy assumes an intelligent populus.

when this nation was founded, it was set up in such a way that the educated could "abuse" the system, to ensure that intelligent decisions were made.

now, too many people have a voice.

it's an interesting balancing game.