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  • States' Rights

    Those of you who have known my positions here on Apolyton, know that I am weary of states' rights arguments. But I don't think I fully, clearly explained why I don't support stronger states' rights.

    White Southerners' states' rights arguments have historically been merely a facade in attempts to preserve white supremacy -- this is my opinion, based on my perceptions on what I have read and learned.

    1) Republicans in the immediate years before the Civil War wanted to restrict slavery to where it alredy existed.

    Southern leaders argued to maintain strong states' rights in order to prevent federal government from becoming too powerful.

    2) During the 1890's, the Republican national convention platform included a statement declaring that the political and racial violence of the Southern states injusticely disfranchised black citizens.

    Southern leaders argued to maintain states' rights in order to prevent federal government authorities from "corrupting" the voting process.

    3) During the 20th century civil rights movement, the federal government, under pressure from mass-organized protests, moved towards giving black citizens back their civil rights and towards equality.

    Southern leaders argued for states' rights in order to prevent the federal government from trampling over state constitutions.


    The above three historical examples show how everytime there was an attempt to give blacks equality, white Southerners would get all hot-headed, and huff and puff about states' rights.

    Not all white southerners argued for states' rights to preserve white supremacy in their respective state, and instead, those people argued for more legitimate, respectable reasons.

    But given the historical evidence in how many other white Southerners argued for states' rights, I have the opinion that states' rights has been nothing more but a facade in order to preserve white supremacy.
    A lot of Republicans are not racist, but a lot of racists are Republican.

  • #2
    OK, I'll post this agin. There is a really great website on the causes of the Civil War that has transcripts of the speeches given by Pro-secession politicians in the state houses of the southern states. The speeches pretty much say it all. Slavery was the first thing on their minds. The post is:
    Discover the latest breaking news in CA and around the world — politics, weather, entertainment, lifestyle, finance, sports and much more.
    "I say shoot'em all and let God sort it out in the end!

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    • #3
      But given the historical evidence in how many other white Southerners argued for states' rights, I have the opinion that states' rights has been nothing more but a facade in order to preserve white supremacy.

      We should remove the vile 10th Amendment from the Constitution post haste.
      I make no bones about my moral support for [terrorist] organizations. - chegitz guevara
      For those who aspire to live in a high cost, high tax, big government place, our nation and the world offers plenty of options. Vermont, Canada and Venezuela all offer you the opportunity to live in the socialist, big government paradise you long for. –Senator Rubio

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      • #4
        Originally posted by DinoDoc
        But given the historical evidence in how many other white Southerners argued for states' rights, I have the opinion that states' rights has been nothing more but a facade in order to preserve white supremacy.

        We should remove the vile 10th Amendment from the Constitution post haste.
        smartass

        I can respect other, more legitimate states' rights arguments even if I may still disagree -- I just have no respect for white Southerners who have historically argued for states' rights in the interest of maintaining white supremacy.
        A lot of Republicans are not racist, but a lot of racists are Republican.

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        • #5
          If I had my way, there wouldn't even be states We're one country dammit! It's stupid to keep using old historical borders. I think there should be an elimination of states and a complete reorganization of the way our country is defined; internally.
          To us, it is the BEAST.

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          • #6
            Just so one part of States' Rights has been construed in such a way, does that mean that everyone that believe the States have rights (including those that believe in the 10th Amendment) are racists?

            Because that is what you are insinuating, very strongly.

            I can respect other, more legitimate states' rights arguments even if I may still disagree


            I have the opinion that states' rights has been nothing more but a facade in order to preserve white supremacy.


            So which is it? Either you can respect legitimate states' rights arguments, or states' rights are simply preservation of white supremecy and nothing more. You said both of these statements, so which is it?
            “I give you a new commandment, that you love one another. Just as I have loved you, you also should love one another. By this everyone will know that you are my disciples, if you have love for one another.”
            - John 13:34-35 (NRSV)

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            • #7
              So, you want to change the constitution because supporters of something you detest can use it to further their own ends?

              How typically... Leftist.

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              • #8
                There's not necessarily a conflict between the two views.

                People can and do have differences over the proper relation between the states and the national government. But there's no question that States Rights has been been white supremacists' favorite constitutional "principle." To claim otherwise is to be totally ignorant of American history.

                Or at least it's been their favorite when the principle can be used to defend racist practices. Somehow, states rights advocates haven't been as quick to defend, say, the right of the University of Michigan to set its own admissions policies without federal interference.
                "When all else fails, a pigheaded refusal to look facts in the face will see us through." -- General Sir Anthony Cecil Hogmanay Melchett

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                • #9
                  People can and do have differences over the proper relation between the states and the national government. But there's no question that States Rights has been been white supremacists' favorite constitutional "principle."


                  When you have someone saying that states' rights is ONLY racist (which Mr. Fun seems in the habit of saying) then there is a conflict between the two views.
                  “I give you a new commandment, that you love one another. Just as I have loved you, you also should love one another. By this everyone will know that you are my disciples, if you have love for one another.”
                  - John 13:34-35 (NRSV)

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                  • #10
                    it's clear that government works better and better represents the citizens of a specific area if government is localized.


                    thanks
                    "Flutie was better than Kelly, Elway, Esiason and Cunningham." - Ben Kenobi
                    "I have nothing against Wilson, but he's nowhere near the same calibre of QB as Flutie. Flutie threw for 5k+ yards in the CFL." -Ben Kenobi

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                    • #11
                      Originally posted by Albert Speer
                      it's clear that government works better and better represents the citizens of a specific area if government is localized.
                      In general, yes.

                      Except when the local government condones terror directed against a segment of the population, or even engages in that terror itself.
                      "When all else fails, a pigheaded refusal to look facts in the face will see us through." -- General Sir Anthony Cecil Hogmanay Melchett

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                      • #12
                        True, Albert.


                        You know, when I'm "weary" of something, I tend to not bring it up, not do it any more, stop.
                        Life is not measured by the number of breaths you take, but by the moments that take your breath away.
                        "Hating America is something best left to Mobius. He is an expert Yank hater.
                        He also hates Texans and Australians, he does diversify." ~ Braindead

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                        • #13
                          Me thinks he isn't as weary of it as he says he is .
                          “I give you a new commandment, that you love one another. Just as I have loved you, you also should love one another. By this everyone will know that you are my disciples, if you have love for one another.”
                          - John 13:34-35 (NRSV)

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                          • #14
                            I think he's full of crap. Is that to the point, or what ?
                            Life is not measured by the number of breaths you take, but by the moments that take your breath away.
                            "Hating America is something best left to Mobius. He is an expert Yank hater.
                            He also hates Texans and Australians, he does diversify." ~ Braindead

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                            • #15
                              uh Clem:

                              Except when the local government condones terror directed against a segment of the population, or even engages in that terror itself.
                              a national government is just as capable of the same...
                              "Flutie was better than Kelly, Elway, Esiason and Cunningham." - Ben Kenobi
                              "I have nothing against Wilson, but he's nowhere near the same calibre of QB as Flutie. Flutie threw for 5k+ yards in the CFL." -Ben Kenobi

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