Why are Americans so different from the rest of us Westerners

[HershOstropoler]

"So you are admitting that you can't match our obsessiveness?"

Well there's the Brit obsession with "ze war", and the german obsession with whining... probably it's not unusual, just more annoying to the outisder (while the german for example creates some funny perceptions by Americans).

[Sikander]

I think part of the American obsession with competitiveness comes from being a rather new player internationally. For most Americans a connection to the larger world is a phenomena of the last hundred years, and one which wasn't particularly strong until the second world war. The Cold War added a lot of fuel to that fire, as both the Russians and Americans sought to outdo each other in every possible sphere in order to bring more glory to their respective causes. Instead of being an outsider, America was involved to a very high degree in places that most Americans didn't even know existed previously.

For most people here it may seem strange that for Americans being a player internationally is a relatively new thing, but consider the fact that it often takes a lot of time for news events to have an impact on the average man. For my Great Grandparents WW2 was a big event, but not one that reshaped their consciousness. Their memories were of the Wild West, Indians, farming, ranching and the Great Depression. For my grandparents generation WW2 was the single largest event in their outlook. They were generally ignorant of the world as a whole, except the places that they fought. Their experiences of the larger and strange world made them hew much more closely to the idea of nationalism, as it was one of the few things that was familiar and comfortable in a world at war. For my parent's generation the larger world was more familiar, but colored by the perceptions of the paranoic phase of the Cold War and the general reduction of stature that the Western Europeans had in that new world.

My generation grew up with a mature Cold War and a familiarity with hot spots around the world and political involvement on every continent. Contrary to Frogger's impressions, this was not a conflict relegated to the sphere of the mind only, nor were the means of that war generally out of step with its potential consequences. I do hope that some decent histories of this huge and long conflict come out, as I fear that many of those who are part of the generation following mine (who btw make up a majority of posters here) are not nearly as knowledgeable about the Cold War as they are about WW2, or WW1 for that matter. It may not have all that much major power combat, but it was the largest war in the history of mankind if you measure such things by the numbers of people involved across the span of 50 years. It was a war of shadows in many respects, and I hope that enough people come forward with their experiences and record them before time distorts the whole thing in the absence of evidence.

[Tingkai]

Originally posted by Tingkai
Canada never went running to the US to protect it during the Cold War. In fact, the US was the one who was asking Canada and other Nato nations to help. I can't recall anytime when the other Nato nations asked the US to contribute more.

Originally posted by Ted Striker


So many places I could with that one.

I thought for sure someone would bite. I got to work on my baiting skills.

[Tingkai]

Originally posted by Sikander
I think part of the American obsession with competitiveness comes from being a rather new player internationally. For most Americans a connection to the larger world is a phenomena of the last hundred years, and one which wasn't particularly strong until the second world war. ...

For most people here it may seem strange that for Americans being a player internationally is a relatively new thing, but consider the fact that it often takes a lot of time for news events to have an impact on the average man.

I would have thought that the vast majority of American cannot remember a time when the US was a minor player on the world scene. The US position as a superpower is taken for granted. Almost every American I meet perceives the US as the policeman of the world.

[Sikander]

Originally posted by Tingkai

I would have thought that the vast majority of American cannot remember a time when the US was a minor player on the world scene. The US position as a superpower is taken for granted. Almost every American I meet perceives the US as the policeman of the world.

That is true, but you have to remember that this sort of stuff takes time to filter into the consciousness. We learn a lot from our parents for instance, both facts and more importantly values and to some degree perspectives. For my grandparents the depression had a lot more impact on them than the Cold War, even though the depression only lasted a dozen or so years while the Cold War lasted 50. They didn't seem to give a damn about political ideologies, only Christianity. My parents were far more political, and a lot more aware of the world at large, especially where the Cold War touched that world. I feel that my generation was the first raised almost entirely within the framework of the new reality, as both my own experiences as well as those of my parents took into account the full extent of the U.S. position in the world.

Of course I am 41 years old, which makes me an old man on this forum, so you are probably correct about the average American's level of awareness of the situation. But keep in mind that today's CEOs and policy makers are generally my age and older, so that their perceptions carry more weight in policy decisions of all sorts.

[HershOstropoler]

Sikander:

"I think part of the American obsession with competitiveness comes from being a rather new player internationally... The Cold War added a lot of fuel to that fire, as both the Russians and Americans sought to outdo each other in every possible sphere in order to bring more glory to their respective causes."

I don't think it is about competitiveness as there is no serious attempt to compete, just to claim superiority. That can be quite odd, like the incessant hyping of GAAP (which curiously ended about a year ago). Or there is a general unwillingness to seriously consider and learn from alternative legal systems - criticism of the US system is then connected with a comparison of a bizarre caricature of foreign systems (or more funnily, a US lawyer telling me that federalism is unique to the US ).

"I feel that my generation was the first raised almost entirely within the framework of the new reality, as both my own experiences as well as those of my parents took into account the full extent of the U.S. position in the world."

If that is the case, then why is it that US media, politicians, pundits etc usually present a totally unrealistic picture of that position ?

[Alexander's Horse]

Originally posted by Sikander


You'll never know.

Eh! We were once part of the British empire, the greatest empire the world has ever seen, and we were full British citizens, unlike the coloured colonies. Our MP's sat in the British parliament and took seats in Britain long after federation. Our Prime Minister was part of the British war cabinet. So f8ck you. We've been part of this world domination game a lot longer than you.

[Drogue]

Originally posted by DinoDoc
I think that you forget the Brits.

About the War on Terrorism.
I was unaware that Britain is for the War on Terrorism. AFAIK, that's just Blair. If Iraq manages to get through Parliament, I'll be very surprised.

[Jac de Molay]

Originally posted by Agathon

Parts of Detroit look like the third world (and Libya has a lower infant mortality rate than Detroit). And hardly any of us for would swap their health system for what you have.

You don't know what you're talking about. Parts of detroit don't look like the third world- Parts of detroit look like a post-apocalypic dystopian nightmare. You really should visit these places before you spout off.

At any rate, our particular hellhole has more music and culture than your entire pissant country combined.

[DinoDoc]

Originally posted by Frogger
It's obvious that being good friends doesn't make them give a damn about trade concerns, so what's in it for us?

We won the lumber fight over lumber before the WTO. Let it go.

Drogue: Read a few posts down to find out what I was talking about in the post you quote.

[HershOstropoler]

"We won the lumber fight before the WTO."

You did ? This time I have to ask, "link?"

[DinoDoc]

Originally posted by HershOstropoler
You did ? This time I have to ask, "link?"

Scroll down to "WTO Adopts Report Upholding U.S. Position on Canadian Lumber Subsidies:" http://www.usembassy.it/file2002_11/alia/a2110105.htm

[HershOstropoler]

"The WTO panel report that was adopted today addresses only the August 9, 2001, U.S. preliminary countervailing duty determination.... In addition to this WTO proceeding, Canada has also contested the U.S. decision on final countervailing duties that was announced in May 2002. That proceeding is now underway."

So you partly won the minor of two cases.

[DinoDoc]

Originally posted by HershOstropoler
So you partly won the minor of two cases.

I think we differ on which is the minor of the two cases.

[Ozz]

Originally posted by DetroitDave You don't know what you're talking about. Parts of detroit don't look like the third world- Parts of detroit look like a post-apocalypic dystopian nightmare. You really should visit these places before you spout off.

At any rate, our particular hellhole has more music and culture than your entire pissant country combined.

I spent a alot of time there when I worked for CP rail.
It was like being IN fallout2. He should visit there, with
a guide. It's a very vibrant place and a hell lot more fun
than anywhere i've been in Canada, hell of alot more
dangerous than anywhere i've been in Canada too.
I think there is a connection here.

Your right about the music and culture, if you leave out
the Maritimes.